She called my bluff!

   / She called my bluff! #21  
Lots of good replies. My contribution - my dealer pretty much said that the 24D, in his opinion, had too much horsepower for the chassis. Not that it wouldn't come in handy when running powered implements like a post hole digger or a snow blower, but in general that the small Class I chassis runs out of weight and traction long before the 24 HP is used up. He said the 18 was a better match for the chassis, and all I can say, not having tried a 24, is that the 18 is an excellent match.

Some of the differences in the "D" models, not available in the 18, are, in addition to the wraparound headlights, the tilt/telescope steering, swivel seat, crank adjustable 3PH tilt and flexible 3PH hookup arms. The 21 and 24 have slightly more hydraulic pump capacity (4.9 vs. 4.0 GPM), but that doesn't seem to have any effect on the actual work they'll do - the 3PH and 12LA loader capacities are identical.

All are/were available with gears or hydro; the 18 with either 2WD or FWD. Comparing apples to apples, if you equip them all with FWD and hydro, they have identical 2 speed range (the more powerful ones are very marginally faster at top speed). The position control on the 3PH does have an adjustable, locking stop that helps repeat the drop locations.

I have to be honest; I can say that more horsepower would be good. But, before I would move up in the Class I, I would look at the TC30 or move up to Class II, the TC33D. In fact, that's what I went in to buy. But, I found out that 1265 pounds lift at the 3PH is more than even bigger tractors from the "other" brands, and will lift any implement I ever want to lift, and the 12LA loader will do almost everything the 7308 will on the TC30, 29D and 33D. Even at the lower of the published numbers, 750# vs. 875# did not seem like it would make enough difference to make it worth going up to the Class II. Regardless, when I start thinking about more horsepower, I start thinking about a TN65 or something, not a 24D.

I was almost tempted by the flex hookups on the 3PH, but I decided I would probably look into a quick hitch. But, two things happened. First, I discovered that some quick hitches have limitations (won't fit all implements, add weight, position the implement further back) or are very expensive (the several triangular ones looked interesting, but not at over $1K to get 3 implements hooked up). Second, I discovered, after more than 250 hours and lots of implement changes, that it's not all that difficult to kick the attachments around until they line up. If I ever get too lazy for that, I'll build wheeled dollies for the attachments that make them easy to roll around until they line up.

I don't have anything to offer about the snowblower - note my location. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif But, I run a 4' Rhino SE brush hog, 4' box blade, 6' TSC (KK?) landscape rake, and I made a humongous root rake that mounts on my loader bucket that really works great! (see attachment)(yes, that's en entire small tree sticking out of that mass of grape vine roots). Not bad for 18 HP. I've put 250 hours on it in 5 months, with a 15 day vacation in the middle of that or I'd probably be near 300 hours. My only problems have been a bent power steering cylinder (replaced by my dealer under warranty even though I probably bent it) and a small current problem that is likely fuel-filter related (I haven't had a chance to check it, yet). Also, my loader controls had a leaking hydraulic fitting, which I tightened,

It's filthy dirty, scratched all to heck and back, has a small rear in the top of the seat back, has a messed up PTO shaft cover, and the hinged cover over the PTO connection came off. About what you'd expect from something that has piled up that many hours that quickly - rode hard and put away wet.

But, you couldn't tear it away from me.
 

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   / She called my bluff! #22  
I have a TC24D and I love it. I think the power for the size is a great combination. Then again I like a Colt Officer's model 45ACP. A great deal of power in a small package. Personally, I'd rather have a little more power than a little too little. My TC24D is my favorite tractor.
 
   / She called my bluff! #23  
Actually on the 24D you do not get the tilt/telescoping wheel, swivel seat, or the crank adjustable 3PH, not sure what the flexible link arms are (I'm still a newbie) but I don't think I have those either. So that leaves me w/ the wrap around headlights and the retractable seatbelt. Not sure why they called it a D, but they did. At 90 hrs. though I love my 24D. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
   / She called my bluff! #24  
<font color="blue"> Not sure why they called it a D, but they did. </font>

It's a bummer that the Class 1 D's aren't as deluxe as the Class 2 & 3 D's
 
   / She called my bluff! #25  
My mistake. When I bought my tractor, I was looking at a 33D and ended up with the 18. My memory got faulty on what the D package included on the various categories. All the more reason why I'm happy I got the 18 - enough power and a lot less $$$.
 
   / She called my bluff! #26  
Regardless of the fact that my TC24D does not have a tilt - telescope steering, it is still an amazing little tractor and very nicely designed. I think the key for all of us is to get a tractor that does what needs to be done. I am looking at getting a snowblower for the back of my tractor and I would question if an 18 hp would be strong enough to operate a 54" blower in 12" of snow. I am looking at several brands of blowers and the size seems about right, but double check the required hp because the engine hp rating is typically several hp higher than the pto hp rating. I don't recall the pto hp rating on the TC18, but I suspect it is something below 15? If so, it will probably have a hard time with a snow blower of that size, especially so when the snow gets deep or heavy. A TC21 or 24 might be more suitable.

With the exception of the blower, I think an 18 is an amazing tractor too. I looked at them but I was worried about 2 things, I have very steep hills (the kids toboggan down one of our slopes) and I was worried about the ablity to blow snow with an 18. I got a good price on a 24 and with the price of the 21 and the 24 so close together I dismissed the 21 in favor of the extra power.
 
   / She called my bluff! #27  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I think the key for all of us is to get a tractor that does what needs to be done. )</font>

Agreed - if I had to run a snowblower or if I had hills, I would have gone for more power. I do have about a 1 foot change of elevation, over 100 feet, on my entire 5 acres, which will increase to as much as 3 feet in about 200 feet when my pond and drainage plan is completed. Until then, with all the rain, I have more use for an outboard motor than a snowblower /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif . The 18 has right at about 15 PTO HP.

For the future, if anyone wants the verstility of the current category I tractors (18, 21D, 24D), it looks like they'll have to get the 24D, because the new TZ18 and TZ21 won't have the hydrualic capacity or the 3PH lift capacity of the current models. If most people were buying the 24D anyway, and with a hole in the comparative market lineup by not having sub-compacts, the changes make sense for New Holland - but I'm sure glad I bought when I did.

Now, if I could just locate a mini-excavator for less than $8,500, I will never regret having passed on the used TC33D with a backhoe.
 
   / She called my bluff!
  • Thread Starter
#28  
It's settled then - I am going to stick to the 24 HP tractor, probably NH or Kubota. It comes down to the snowblower. We get some serious snow that often gets mixed with some rain, making any man's back strain with one shovel full. It depends on the texture whether or not it can be thrown with a snowblower, but if it can, it takes power! All my other tasks I could save some money and go with the smaller HP. I just don't want to be going down the road wishing I had more power.

So hopefully this weekend I can get some dealers and see who can sharpen their pencils. I will make sure to ask the questions regarding transportation during warranty work, what will be done if the fuel tank ruptures, 50 hour service included, etc, etc, etc. There are a few good dealers within an hour, those details could make the difference.

I have really gone back and forth over the days checking back to this post. 18HP? 24HP? Do I even need a tractor? Why not? And to think I bought my house in an hour!!! Thanks for the input, hopefully I'll have some news after this weekend.

Brad
 
   / She called my bluff! #29  
Brad,

Good luck. You can't go wrong with Orange or Blue (of course we prefer blue in this section of tbn /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif)

We want action shots once you get it home.
 
   / She called my bluff! #30  
Orange or Blue is a tough choice, and since I own both I can tell you that both are good machines. My Kubota is larger with FEL and backhoe, but totally reliable and at the time (about 3 years ago) was the best bang for the buck. My NH is new this summer, I wanted a smaller tractor for smaller tasks. The dealer made most of the difference to me in why I chose NH this time. And that said, I have a 9 year relationship with the Kubota/Cub Cadet dealer, things just didn't work out this time, and he admitted in the end to screwing up.

But, in comparing the NH and Kubotas, I am very glad that I ended up with the NH this time. The specs, sizes, etc are very close to each other so that really brought the arguement down to money. But something I missed the first round through was DESIGN. I don't mean to say is the color or the shape, I mean the placement of the controls, the added features like the built in tool box, its location, the placement of the pedals, selectors, and even the fact that you can check the oil without popping the hood. I went back and relooked over the Kubotas TWICE since my purchase of my NH, call it buyers remorse??? But each time I walked away MORE convinced I got the right tractor for me.

Now let me say this, again, both are nice tractors, but in an apple to apple comparison of two specific tractors, I think the NH TC24D was the better tractor. Go up in size or down and size and you might come to a totally different conclusion. And if the price were the same then just go toss a coin. In this case, I bought the cheaper tractor, $1200 cheaper because the Kubota dealer didn't deal, and I think I got the better tractor cheaper. That does not mean I am totally set on NH. I like my B2910 too, and a couple years ago, I think it was the best choice for what I needed.
 

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