The right tractor for towing/forestry work

[tradosaurus]

Hi,
I haven't really posted on this forum but have spoken to several of you by pm, soaking in all the wisdom that i can. I am considering purchasing a tractor with the primary purpose of towing a log loader and doing forestry work. Up until this year I've been reluctant on investing in a tractor primarily because of the maintenance requirements. I think the right tool for the right job approach is something had focused on, leaning towards frugal options.

Currently for basic skidding and yard work I've had relied other off road vehicles, which to my surprise is meeting all but one my requirements. Some logging work, specifically loading heavy 24"+ dia trees, has become a challenge and while I could manage I wanted to invest in something that made it easier. This year I bought a used log loader, a Metavic 1400 loader with 18RF trailer and started looking at the best towing options. I will be primarily using off road trails with some steep and hilly terrain, mildly hard soil (clay like), on mostly forest populated land. As such I need something that can tow this heavy trailer up/down hills and not fall apart. I have focused on identifying tractors that provide stability and power for the work, and quickly realized there is a lot to consider. With the hills, I felt full body steel frame tractors with 4WD would be best. I don't plan on loading the trailer up to its max capacity and will likely load a minimal amount on most trips.

I found a used 2006 Mahindra 4530 4WD w/o a loader available that seems to check all the boxes with exception to towing capacity, which I understand isn't something normally included on manufacturer specifications. The engine has 42hp and has less than 900 hours on it. I've done some basic research and understand there may be some issues which the tractor could have.

I am planning on down grading the trailer, moving the loader over to the new trailer to reduce the total weight
Current estimated log loader weight- Metavic 1400 + Metavic 18RF: 4125lb (18500 payload)
Future estimated log loader weight- Metavic 1400 + Metavic 17RF: 3225lb (14000 payload)

Is there a way to tell if the tractor I am considering would have enough towing capacity? Are there alternative vehicles (tractors) that I should consider - eg, a skid loader vs compact?

I appreciate any suggestions. Thanks!

One thing I would suggest is to look under the tractor you are looking to buy and see what kind of underside protection there is. What could be damaged? Torn off?
Look at the maximum width you want to maneuver within the trees. If you keep the bucket on the front that will usually be your widest point.
If you have to have a cab tractor might want to look at a forestry protection cage around the cab.
Lastly consider the total weight of your tractor/implement. I rented a skid steer and with the front rotary cutter I had about 12,000 lbs. Within 2 hrs of doing work within my trees, I sunk the skid steer up to the treads.

 

[DieselBound]

I ran a material dump trailer behind my NX5510 (55hp). Trailer weight 3k lbs (empty). It had surge brakes, so no worry about being pushed around: I could feel a bit of push, but if push came to shove the trailer's brakes should operate. I was operating in the higher end of load capacity, 10k to 12k, but no significant grades (other than departing from property where I was fetching the material from; pulling up a bit up on to the roadway, which had a slight upward grade, felt like an elephant coming out of a snow bank). Probably a good 130 runs in all: which should garner me more than novice status on such matters. Problem with surge brakes is that they don't work in reverse, in which case it's not a good idea to back down a hill (lest the tail run off with the dog)!

Rough terrain, uneven, hills and a lot of weight with a CUT isn't a good combo. No real room for error. Stuff is going to break, and this is going to imperil the operator.

If one can batch up the work then it would be recommended to then rent the appropriate equipment to do the particular work/task. By "batch up" I mean scheduling of [like] work to be done (be done in a given period- not ad hoc).

 

[DieselBound]

One thing I would suggest is to look under the tractor you are looking to buy and see what kind of underside protection there is. What could be damaged? Torn off?
Look at the maximum width you want to maneuver within the trees. If you keep the bucket on the front that will usually be your widest point.
If you have to have a cab tractor might want to look at a forestry protection cage around the cab.
Lastly consider the total weight of your tractor/implement. I rented a skid steer and with the front rotary cutter I had about 12,000 lbs. Within 2 hrs of doing work within my trees, I sunk the skid steer up to the treads.

I've experienced that sinking feeling! I once sank a 9k lb, rented, excavator. But, renting is still the best way to go if one cannot afford industrial-level equipment for use in nasty situations/environments. Such equipment is armored up: other than getting stuck, getting into brush isn't going to bust stuff up like can happen with a CUT. Bust your CUT and it can be more expensive to repair than the cost of renting equipment: do this more than once and, well, shame on you!

 

[ptsg]

In my country, it's very common to see tractors pulling log cranes and log trailers. Even driving on the road with a full load. Also, in Europe, the tow ratings of tractors can be found on the spec sheets, both brakes and un-braked.

Some of these trailers have brakes, some don't. Some have hydraulic drive on the trailers, some have mechanical drive, others don't. Some mount the crane on the tractor, others mount the crane on the trailer. There is literally an option for all tastes.

Of course, the tractor and trailer are matched to each other (most of the times) and the operator does need to be aware of the stopping ability of the entire combo and how it will behave. You won't see a tractor much smaller than a large frame 50hp tractor often, however I've seen some 35 HP tractors doing this work as well.

People who do it for a living and can justify the extra expense, will shield the entire bottom of the tractor and also fit R1 Forestry tires. Other tend to run R1 Radial tires.

The bigger loggers will usually run a bigger 150HP+ Valtra tractor with the matched logging trailer.

 

[dodge man]

What are you doing with the logs? Would you do other work with the tractor? It just seems like it would be a mistake to buy a tractor without a loader. You might wish for a grapple and/or forks in the future.

 

[fruitcakesa]

Weight and HP were the reason I upgraded from an L4630 to the M6040.
My main working task besides snow removal was log skidding.
I outfitted it with a grapple fork on the loader and a skidding winch on the 3ph.
I estimate working weight at around 7500 lbs which allows me to haul tree length [70+ ft] logs. with little difficulty.

 

[jonsstihl]

I think tractor weight is going to be important in your decision. My L4740 is pushing close to 8000 lbs. tractor is 4600 plus 1400 loader plus 1500lbs of ballast in the tires and nothing on the 3pt. I'm pretty sure your working weight on your M6040 is higher than that unless your tires aren't filled. Just realized you may have an open station so you might be close on the weight.

I wouldn't want to be pulling 14000 lbs of logging trailer in the woods. hills and mud will greatly reduce traction. I do have R4 tires with no chains so...

 

[hslogger]

I have to say, the most dangerous piece of equipment in the woods is a farm tractor...... I know it aggravates but they really aren't designed for that use even though you can put all kinds of components on them.

 

[antryan]

Wow, thanks for all the responses!

@4570Man @oosik @Hay Dude Thanks! It appears the trailer doesn't have the hydraulic break assist feature but that is an option I can get on the next one. I will look and see if air breaks are possible as well.

@DieselBound thanks for added break information. I've never heard of surge breaks but do know the trailer has optional hydraulic break assists. It just appears the one I got might not have that option installed. It doesn't have a PTO shaft or added hydraulic cable aside from those to control the grapple.

@tradosaurus Great point about underbody protection! I've added skid plates on my off road vehicles and those saved me from some damages. I never considered it for a tractor but it makes sense.

@LD1 You are correct. I apologize for the lack of clarity on what I referenced as hills. The contour of the property is moderately steep to steep going from 600ft above sea level to 550ft on one side and from 550ft to 700ft (some 15% slopes) on the other side, essentially in the middle of 3 mountains. 5.6 acres of the parcel is greater than 25% steep slope. I don't plan on taking the tractor close to that 25% slope - and have service trails I am rebuilding to allow some access. I am worried about the tractor sitting on the 8% or 10% slopes while I load. My off road vehicles don't have much of a problem.

I am considering just a bare tractor since I don't have a need for the loader "just now". I would get the loader if it would improve weight or reduce pushing the tractor as you mentioned.

@MossRoad Thanks for the lookup link, Mahindra didn't provide that to me when I called and it seemed as if they really just didn't want to help. Their advice was "contact a dealer"...

@ddbackhoe I missed that, thank you! It looks like I need a much bigger machine.

@ptsg Thanks! I was worried about getting something too small... I wouldn't want to attempt pulling a log trailer with a lawn mower. Those photos were awesome.

@dodge man My current objective is clean up, pulling felled trees out of the forest and salvaging whatever they can be used for. The property hasn't been maintained in atleast 7 years. I would likely do more work with the tractor but primarily the need would be in towing out the trailer. The trailer has a winch to skid up logs next to the trailer and a loader to lift them.

@fruitcakesa Thanks! I think getting a grapple fork loader would be ideal, I just hadn't considered it as an primary need. It appears I need to consider that option. I like the M6040. Do you haul on rough terrain?

 

[Cycledude]

Antryan a 40 horse tractor will definitely be way to small for what your wanting to do, more like double the size is what will be needed