timer on small gas water pump

[Richard001]

Yes ,Load 2 has a reading , load 1 no reading- open. thk/u

OK great, so now turn the dial so that there is some time on the timer. When you do that, load 1 should have a reading and load 2 should not.

 

[nils gustafson]

OK great, so now turn the dial so that there is some time on the timer. When you do that, load 1 should have a reading and load 2 should not.

No, after turning the dial all stays the same ?

 

[the old grind]

Using the wrong terminal for common when testing? Doesn't sound tight for SPDT. whatever voltage the switch is rated for might be needed for the buzzer. (NA here)

 

[thclimer]

I'm not sure this is the exact model that you ordered but the following video should provide a good understanding on how these mechanical timers work:

 

[Richard001]

Yes interesting video but unfouritialy, he does not demonstrate the NC contact operation.

 

[the old grind]

I'd use one load/term to ground a SGE ignition if GTS and the other to energize it if the engine is GTR. A switch is a switch & SPDT is very basic. We use those 'cube' auto relays with SPDT contacts for other stuff to, just energized trip vs timed. One load is closed and one is open when the timer is ticking. When time's up they reverse functions. Easy peasy.

 

[Richard001]

Well according to this user instruction sheet I found on the internet, you have to wire the two line input terminals together for this to work as a spdt.

Note this bottom schematic, shows both lines wired together, then load1 or load2 will work for this application.

 

[nils gustafson]

Well according to this user instruction sheet I found on the internet, you have to wire the two line input terminals together for this to work as a spdt.
View attachment 710509
Note this bottom schematic, shows both lines wired together, then load1 or load2 will work for this application.

Lots of good input here and well thought , but i'm lost (reverse action switching ? ) SEG , GTS ignition, cube ignitions ?? I'm just a good valve lapper !! . Is the reverse action switching schematic drawing the one I should show my sparky buddy for help? thk/u. gus..

 

[the old grind]

Don't think of reversing or other bits that may confuse. From the common terminal either load will be on or off whether the timer is ticking or clicks off. Just use whichever either grounds your ignition to run or to stop. Connect in series to the magneto's primary wire if you can (point ign) or a gen's on/off switch (pointless ign)

If the timer is strictly mechanical no need to supply 120v or anything. Again just connect common to the engine (ground) or grounded term of a gen's on/off switch and whichever load terminal works to ground or not to shut 'er down. btw, betting you'll agree it's pretty simple once you've done it.

 

[nils gustafson]

Don't think of reversing or other bits that may confuse. From the common terminal either load will be on or off whether the timer is ticking or clicks off. Just use whichever either grounds your ignition to run or to stop. Connect in series to the magneto's primary wire if you can (point ign) or a gen's on/off switch (pointless ign)

If the timer is strictly mechanical no need to supply 120v or anything. Again just connect common to the engine (ground) or grounded term of a gen's on/off switch and whichever load terminal works to ground or not to shut 'er down. btw, betting you'll agree it's pretty simple once you've done it.

Hello; so which of the above posted wiring diagrams should i go by ? thk/u.

 

[the old grind]

Diagrams show a lot that you wouldn't use. My pump (not gen ) has an on/off switch. By disconnecting the wires to it I could test which position is off or on then choose L1 or L2 and its line to get the same on/off function with the timer. Just two terminals to connect to vs the OEM switch. Wired in parallel with that would allow timed or normal operation. Wired in series with it they'd both have to be on but either could shut 'er down.

So when the timer is 'on' (turn past 5 min) L1 & L2 should each reverse from 'open' to 'closed' accordingly. (easier to test from combined/jumpered 'common') Any SPDT switch would do the job, it's just that yours has the timer vs a handle/button and you don't need all its functions. Which load terminal will work for you is a matter of trial and error.

 

[nils gustafson]

Diagrams show a lot that you wouldn't use. My pump (not gen ) has an on/off switch. By disconnecting the wires to it I could test which position is off or on then choose L1 or L2 and its line to get the same on/off function with the timer. Just two terminals to connect to vs the OEM switch. Wired in parallel with that would allow timed or normal operation. Wired in series with it they'd both have to be on but either could shut 'er down.

So when the timer is 'on' (turn past 5 min) L1 & L2 should each reverse from 'open' to 'closed' accordingly. (easier to test from combined/jumpered 'common') Any SPDT switch would do the job, it's just that yours has the timer vs a handle/button and you don't need all its functions. Which load terminal will work for you is a matter of trial and error.

OK to test we go; thanks for your time

 

[Richard001]

OK to test we go; thanks for your time

Nils - any progress to report ?

 

[nils gustafson]

Nils - any progress to report ?

Busy harvesting plums, going to try and pull the pump this week , will be sure to post a progress when time permits .. thk/s

 

[Richard001]

Nils,

Have you had a chance to get your timer working on your pump ?

Let us know whats going on and if it is working. show us how you did it.

 

[nils gustafson]

Hello; were just finally getting rain ,and in the process of dragging out the pumps.. I am bench testing though , and not getting the results with SPDT timer .. the timer i need, needs to be open when dial is turned (no ground ) then it hits 0 it should be closed ,to ground out the points. Another words at 0 needs contact..
When i'm bench testing, neither L1 or L2 gives me juice at O ? thks/ gus.

 

[Topzide]

What about using a relay? When timer on, energizes relay to open and when current stops at zero, it grounds.

 

[the old grind]

'Gus', can you share another pic showing all the timer's contacts indicating how labelled as 'Line x' & 'Load x'. We want to be sure that your connections/tests will provide the function you need. "It's in there", and you appear to have an older 'ground to stop' ignition. (what 'M' terminal is for on a $25 pegboard ign sw at the hardware store, farm supply, or auto parts)

If there are two 'line' terminals jumper them to work as one. (and you will use it/them) Then each 'load' terminal will be open or closed alternately and reverse whether the time is ticking or shuts off. The buzzer is moot and if I could snip a wire to disable it, say to avoid confusion when testing. If it's meant to buzz at 120v what would we expect to hear when it's used as an momentary grounding device?

Anyway, once you see whether 'load' 1 or 2 makes the connection to 'line' (paired) one 'end' should be grounded, and the other 'tapped' into the points wire. 'Which is which' won't matter. If you have 'pointless' ignition there's still a thin wire to the coil thingie to tap into. It's only the first one that seems a little confusing.

 

[nils gustafson]

timer at 0 no current at load (1) ,,, timer at 0 load (2) got current ,but when load-2 engaged there's current , L-2 goes to 0 no current . being a SPDT switch there's no line 2 . Using OHM meter @ 200ohm to ck for current , thk/u. gus.

 

[the old grind]

Whichever 'load' terminal gets current/beep/readout when the timer is 'off' and not when it's ticking is what we're looking for. Ground that Load term. Tap/tie/replace the 'line' term to any low-tension wire between points or trigger and the coil. (not plug wire)

If it goes like that you'd have a timed ignition. Set the timer then start the pump engine to your choice of interval. btw, I'm not over my thinking that the buzzer might cause back-fed current readings thru it somehow when testing.