Toilet Mystery

[nybirdman]

If you are on a septic tank system;I would guess the tank is full and need of pumping.

 

[MossRoad]

How to test the toilet for internal leaks in the S.

Requires removing the toilet, placing it on a drip tray, filling the bowl with water, and watching it pour out the bottom. Pretty foolproof, quick and easy way to determine if its the toilet or a vent issue.

Should only take about 10-20 minutes to rule out the toilet this way.

 

[k0ua]

Watching this thread with interest. I don't have a problem, but I am always looking to learn new things. I don't have much experience in these things.

 

[N80]

To address some of the last few posts:

Not sure food coloring would help as the bowl is not refilling from the tank unless it is flushed. I think, maybe incorrectly, that if the bowl was leaking and I put blue food coloring in the water all I would see is less blue water but not diluted blue water.

Not on a septic tank. And importantly, everything else in the house is working fine (I hate to even say that, sure I'm jinxed now). Even the sink and shower in the same bathroom are draining perfectly.

I really don't want to remove the toilet. For me, things that take twenty minutes usually end up taking an hour plus a trip to the hardware store. The question I have is that if the part of the S pipe that holds the water had a crack in it, I should be seeing water on the floor, right? I just don't see any way the the upper part of the S is cracked and leaking into the lower part of the S and thus down the drain. On this toiler the upper and lower parts of the S do not communicate except through the channel. In other words, as far as I can tell they do not share a common wall. The floor of the upper S pipe is not the ceiling of the lower part.

I will go in the attic and see if everything looks okay with the vent pipe from that vantage point. It is hard to see on that part of the roof but from what I can see everything looks okay from the ground.

I don't think a plumber is going to go up on my roof. Where the vent stack comes out is three stories up and steeply pitched. I might have to get a roofer to come out and inspect it.

 

[MossRoad]

To address some of the last few posts:

Not sure food coloring would help as the bowl is not refilling from the tank unless it is flushed. I think, maybe incorrectly, that if the bowl was leaking and I put blue food coloring in the water all I would see is less blue water but not diluted blue water.

Not on a septic tank. And importantly, everything else in the house is working fine (I hate to even say that, sure I'm jinxed now). Even the sink and shower in the same bathroom are draining perfectly.

I really don't want to remove the toilet. For me, things that take twenty minutes usually end up taking an hour plus a trip to the hardware store. The question I have is that if the part of the S pipe that holds the water had a crack in it, I should be seeing water on the floor, right? I just don't see any way the the upper part of the S is cracked and leaking into the lower part of the S and thus down the drain. On this toiler the upper and lower parts of the S do not communicate except through the channel. In other words, as far as I can tell they do not share a common wall. The floor of the upper S pipe is not the ceiling of the lower part.

I will go in the attic and see if everything looks okay with the vent pipe from that vantage point. It is hard to see on that part of the roof but from what I can see everything looks okay from the ground.

I don't think a plumber is going to go up on my roof. Where the vent stack comes out is three stories up and steeply pitched. I might have to get a roofer to come out and inspect it.

Not necessarily. It could be an internal leak. I know it seems unlikely, but hey.... (insert ____ happens joke here).

I'd guess that even with a blocked vent that after you flushed, it would eventually stop sucking water out of the toilet until some other device was flushed.

Maybe try filling the bowl with water slowly up to normal level with a bucket. Make sure no other fixtures are draining and watch the water level. If it drains down, there's probably a leak in the S pipe on the toilet. If it doesn't leak down after 15 minutes, turn on the sink and shower and see of it pulls water out of the toilet. If not, try some other fixtures in the house. Stuff like that. If other fixtures cause the toilet to drain, it's probably a vent problem.

 

[N80]

I’ve done the bucket test. The water level starts going down immediately. Slowly but visibly.

This is with nothing else running or draining.

I guess I am going to have to pull the toilet.

 

[MossRoad]

Bummer.

 

[MossRoad]

My dad always told me to buy 2 wax rings when pulling a toilet, because you'll mess one up putting it back in place. I'm so good at it now I buy 3.

 

[JPRambo]

Have you tried a toilet snake? Maybe something got partially flushed and creating a siphon. I worked in a hospital maintenance department for 19 years found a lot of weird things happen.

 

[MossRoad]

Have you tried a toilet snake? Maybe something got partially flushed and creating a siphon. I worked in a hospital maintenance department for 19 years found a lot of weird things happen.

That's definitely worth a try before pulling the toilet.