Welder - Should I Upgrade??

[Avondale]

I am taking an introductory welding course at my local college and have one class left. One thing our instructor is constantly asked is "What machine do I buy"? His reply continues to be "The best quality you can afford for what you want to do". There does not appear to be a single machine that does everything well which may explain why there are still various types on sale.

He does try to steer us towards the 220 machines unless you are sure you will never need that much power. Most machines can be dialed down to lower power requirements that cover most common material thickness (i.e. 24 gg) while small machines can only be dialed up to a fixed level (i.e. 3/16 - 1/4").

Last night, I fixed my broken plow point (cast steel) with a 220 stick machine using some very expensive hi-grade welding rods (MG Super 600) . Current setting was fairly low (80-90a) for the 3/32" rods. Up to this point, I was sure that MIG was the answer for me due to the ease of use but it was not appropriate for this repair, regardless of input voltage.

This suggests to me that I will need to re-think what I currently need and what I might need.

 

[johnnydel29]

I started with a Lincoln 110volt MIG welder and quickly sold it and upgraded to a 220volt unit.


It made a WORLD of difference. Like night a day.




.

This is the what I was thinking. I will be adding 220V plug this weekend. Already have my current 110V pro-mig 140 sold. Thinking about a Hobart Handler 187, currently $599.00 at Tractor Supply or Lincoln 187t for 679.00. I heard the Hobart 187 is a sweet machine.

My current 100V machine has been good, and has worked beyond my expectations. Like I mentioned, I am constantly running it on the highest heat, and the arc on very low settings is pretty terrible for thin stuff. I also like the idea of running the machine on its own seprate independant 220 V circut, give me a nice consitent arc. I am tired of tripping breakers and not being able to even leave a power strip on while welding.

Thanks for your feedback.

 

[LD1]

My opinion would be to get a 220 mig at around 200-225 amps and if you like it, sell your little 110v and get a $100 stick welder that way you'll have the best of both worlds.

I grew up on stick welding and for just being a diy'er I have probabally used over 50lb of rod with great success. That being said I picked up a good used Linde 225amp 220v mig off c-list a few months back for $600 and it is deffinatally the go-to welder. 90% of the time I use it and the other 10% is for something that takes a specialty rod for the stick (Sainless, cast, aluminum, etc)

If you're happy with a 110v unit than a 220v will be a dream come true

 

[nunyabinis]

Tip:

I've never taken a welding course but I was watching the Discovery Channel one evening about the history of welding and they showed a computer controlled MIG welder laying a bead on some really thick steel on a warship. While the MIG welder was laying the bead the head was moving back and forth in a "Z" pattern across the direction of travel.


I tried that the next time I used my MIG welder and SHAZAAM!!! My beads have looked wonderful ever since.

 

[okiecraig]

I am leaning alot from this discussion and shopping for a one-purpose welder:

What's the best welding method (wire or stick) and power setting for building pipe fence using new 3", medium wall steel pipe? Posts every 12 feet and a top rail to start.

If there is a previous post or thread addressing this question, please point me there.....

 

[xlr82v2]

Well,I disagree with you that the 6010 don't make a pretty bead,[kinda like saying the baseball glove won't catch].

Well, Mr. mule, why don't you educate all of us that don't know any better and show some of your 6010 beads that you speak of? Not saying you're wrong, but I've never seen a XX10/11 bead that looked as pretty as one from any of the other rods. Don't just say it, back it up. Otherwise, it's just keystrokes.

Plus,you are supposed to clean your metal before welding,maybe thats why your 6010 beads don't look good?

Never said my 6010 beads didn't look good. I said the rod doesn't lay a pretty bead like the others. You, as an old pipeliner, should know the difference.

Only reason for not cleaning with grinder or brush,would be you can't get it in there.

Absolutely right. Sometimes you can't.

Plus,plus,6010-7010-8010 rods pass x-ray every day here in good ole us of a.

Never said they didn't...

Plus[yeah you guessed it],plus,plus,if you are not storing your 7018 rod in a heated oven type container,after opening can,than you no longer have a low hydrogen rod,

Yeah, I thought that's what I said too...

so might as well use a 6010,[yeah I know 6010 doesn't have the tensile of a 7018,so,use a 7010 if you feel that the 6010 won't beat the tensile of the base metal,which is generally way less than 6,000 psi].

You're certainly free to do so... nobody's stopping you.

Have a great day Mr. Mule.

 

[greenmule]

Well"mr brian",musta hit a raw nerve with you,huh? Well,that happens sometimes.
No,I'm not going to go out of my way to take a picture of one of my 6010 welds and e-mail it too you.Don't need to show you anything,don't even know what you look like,why would I want to do something as childish as that?

But since your into that,why don't you take some pictures of your not so pretty 6010 welds and e-mail them,other wise,how can I believe you? Than I'll judge it for you.

I'd like to see one of your overhead 7018's to While your are at it[I can make pretty welds with them to]

But back to one of the topics here,a 7018 thats not been stored right is not a low/hy rod any mores,so for the life of me,can't figure out why people want to use them.
Now,to put down a good,pretty weld with a 6010 or 7010 does require you to do more than just drag the rod,thus you gotta have a little more skill,it still seems to me for your average welder,they would probably both be about the same with just a little practice,considering the following.

7018 don't restart well,finger nails easy,get more arc strikes with them,plus they are not as deep a penatrating as a xx10 rod,can't downhill and make quality weld with them,can't put an open root bead in with them[well not unless you've tried it about 500 times,and than you can't sometimes,they ain't made for that,rod melts off inside coating,thus you long arc,6010,coating burns off past end,thus you can stick it right in tight root],And like I said,your,supposed to keep them in an oven,and if you don't they obsorb mosture real fast,thus,they are not low/hi.

Main thing with the popularity of industry with the 7018 is hydrogen imbrittlement and its just takes less skill to use one than xx10 rod.Plain ole carbon steel thats not 3-4 inches thick is not affected by this hydrogen imbrittlement issue.[plus,if they are not in oven,they are not helping in this in any case.]

To me,welding is kinda like painting,you can make a pretty bead/cover/weave with 7018,and you can do same with xx10 rod,it just takes a little more skill to make one with a xx10 rod,thus to me a good looking xx10 weld,is prettier than a good looking 7018 weld.

And as far as cleaning your metal before welding,99 percent of time you can,on gas lines,do you think they just clamp em up and weld with out grinding bevel and filing inside od of pipe to get all dirt/rust,and anything else off,before welding? If they didn't 90 percent wouldn't pass x-ray.

 

[xlr82v2]

Greenmule,

I didn't ask you to email anything to me... I asked you to post some pics here to the forum, so that us that don't know any better about 6010 or don't have near the amount of experience as you do with 6010 can learn. Maybe you need a cheater lens to see your monitor too??? Or maybe you're just flash blind. And, what would it matter what I look like? Or any of us on here for that matter? What kind of pompous, bigoted statement is that? Did someone light the string on your tampon or something?

Like I said in the previous post... I don't disagree with anything you say... I know you're an old pipeliner, and I know you love your 6010. Since you're an old pipeliner, I have no doubt that you have oodles and gobs more experience at welding pipe than I do. Fine by me. Kudos to you. I'm not a weldor by trade... never said I was, never pretended to be... but my Dad is... he taught me how to weld. He helped build several of the large draglines and strip shovels that used to be down here in Southern Illinois. So, I believe he knew a fair amount about how to work a stinger, just like you do. But he welded different stuff than you, which had different weld specs than your pipe, and the education that I got from him probably reflects that. There's more than one way to skin a cat...

All I did was post some basic info about some of the more commonly available rods... I don't believe I posted any incorrect information. If I did, let me know what you think is wrong, I'll change the post if I can still edit it. Otherwise, I stand by it. I posted my opinion about what rods I like best based on my experience. Just as you have. But I'm not jumping all over you telling you that you're wrong as you are to me, just because I don't particularly care for 6010, even though I do acknowledge that it has its place on the rod rack.

Also, I don't know about 99% of the time being able to grind your workpiece clean... [that's kinda like saying painting a turd gold makes it so]. I've welded enough stuff where the best you could do was barely get the wire brush in there and scrape the mud and grease and cracked paint off... ain't no way in hades you're gonna get a grinder in there. But yeah, sure, if you're building things like pipelines, you should be able to get it ground clean 99% of the time. No doubt about it.

Oh, one last thing... the 60 in 6010 means 60,000 PSI tensile strength, not 6000 like you posted. Since you're such a stickler, one can only assume that you meant exactly what you typed.

Have a good day sir.

 

[LD1]

I know its not my argument and I know its not 6010 welds.....or even stick for that matter..........But it seems people want to see pics so I'll post a few of the I-beams that I welded together for my pole barn. The pics are of the fisch plate.

 

[JB4310]

I know its not my argument and I know its not 6010 welds.....or even stick for that matter..........But it seems people want to see pics so I'll post a few of the I-beams that I welded together for my pole barn. The pics are of the fisch plate.

110 MIG? flux core? I ask cause it looks like a small bead but could be decieving, looks good though

JB.

 

[LD1]

Linde 225 with .035 wire and 80/20 argon/co2

The plate welded to the beam is 1/4" thick so it is decieving

The weld where the plate is welded to the web of the beam, which would be running horizontal left to right in the pics (the beam is laying down) you can really see how well the weld penetrated

 

[LD1]

pic of what I was talking about

 

[J_J]

pic of what I was talking about

With all due respect, the ratio of height to width ratio doesn't seem correct on the lower bead. Looks like you could have used a little more heat. It looks better than mine. I just need better vision.

 

[LD1]

It probabally looks that way because there was actually about an 1/8" gab between the plate and the beam due to the fact that I welded the beams together and then put the plate across the seam and I didn't grind down the weld. The weld in that pic is actually 3 passes, one on the web of the beam to partially fill the gap, 1 to weld it together, and a final pass to make it look purdy.

Anyone familiar with the old linde's with a heat range control of 1-4 and a heat setting of like 1-6 knows that 4-2 is pretty hot and that's what I welded it at. A little hotter than the chart on the side of the welded reccomended.

No offense though, I enjoy good constructive criticism

 

[greenmule]

Well good morning to you to"mr" brian!

So your daddy taught you something,well good for you. I gotta say though,it appears you know just enough to be dangerous.

And again,if you wanta post some pictures of YOUR welds,go ahead,sure your daddy would be proud.[How did your daddy get in this anyways?]

And to believe you don't weld for your living!![man,will wonders never cease]


LD1,now heres a man that likes to post pictures of his weld! Not bad,but that penatration you say you see is actually undercut on the top edge[looks to me like],your not supposed to have that And looks like a little roll on that same weld.

On a weld like that,you got to point your gun up a little,[gravity],also your travel speed might have been a little slow.

Thats why multiple passes are needed in most applications with thicker material,you don't try and fill the groove in one pass,you put a root in,[than dress up/grind any high spots] than put one over it,in this application on horazontal,you might put a root in,than one one bottom half of root,than one[or more] above the second pass,tying them together. That way is easier,than weaving one over another.

That mig is easy when welding thin stuff flat,but you get out of flat,and get on thicker stuff,it ain't so easy anymores,got to have it turned up enough to insure penatration, than that gravity thing gets you.

 

[xlr82v2]

So someone did light your string... must have been a helluva pop! Oh well, better luck next month.

I guess I'd be all pissy too if that happened to me.... but it won't.

 

[greenmule]

Light my string on my tampon?Did your daddy teach you that saying?

Me and you have talked enough,goodbye,"mr" brian.

 

[xlr82v2]

HAHAHA, I was just taking a shot in the dark on the string... but you pretty much confirmed it for me.... And I'll bet your momma taught you all about it a long time ago. Or, maybe she didn't, which is why you're having such difficulty these days.

Whatever the case may be, have a good one today and hopefully a better one tomorrow!

 

[carpenter383]

pic of what I was talking about

You welds look better than mine do. I have an old millermatic 220 volt 200 amp mig. It seems like I can't clean the material good enough to keep the little holes out of the beads. Any ideas? I'm using argon/co2. What is the correct pressure for the gas?

 

[LD1]

First question is what is the mix ratio of argon and co2 (90/10, 85/15, 80/20, etc) The more argon the better.

On the pressure, the guage you should be looking at should read in cu-ft per hour. A good starting point is 20 cfh when working indoors. If working outside or with a fan running you might need to crank it up to 30 or 35 to keep the shielding gas from blowing away.

If none of this works I would say you probabally have a damaged hose or even and dirty tip full of spatter not letting the gas get to the puddle.

Miller is a good welder and its probably just something stupid like this.

Oh yea.......Pictures would help too