Buying Advice What tractor to buy for general utility work - <50 Acres??

[adirondackmtnman]

OT: Yes, my racing clutch in my last track toy is a different animal altogether, but it was the example I pulled to define the bottomed of clutch life. FWIW, the slipper clutches allow an engine that would over-rev a short gear and be blocked from shifting by the blocker ring because the gears never match speed, to make the gear change, and continue to slip the clutch until the engine speed matches gear's speed, and then lock all automatically with no driver input other than the gear change. Thus you can trail brake silly deep into the apex, counter-steering as you do, and be in the exact right gear to power on once the apex has been hit. The clutches tend to fry because they're slipping far more than a non-slipper clutch.

So you're using a clutch intended for use in a racing/high performance manner, which, through it's use, is destined, if not designed, to fail, as an example for the life of a clutch on a piece of utility equipment? Just trying to get it straight, because if we can use performance applications, then our racer gets a clutch once a year racing a one half mile oval. It doesn't need it, but it gets it when the engine comes out to get freshened...Enlighten us with some anecdote about an actual tractor clutch you've seen fail recently, and your credibility on the topic will increase greatly, O oracle...

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[arrow]

Is a CVT or HST easier to operate than a gear or power shuttle?

Yes or no?

Ease of operation wasn't the subject matter with that being a personal preference. You afforded a skewered view on geared tractors that was an inaccurate assessment at best. Your justification wasn't even in a realm of coherence in my mind. Allow me to give you an example of "clutch life" in a field I know a little bit about. A clutch in a pro stock NHRA car wears at a 4/thousandth to 7 thousandth of an inch per run. Mainly because it's a "pedal" with some feathering from the gate. A funny car or AA/fuel car wears at a rate of .125 per inch or twenty to twenty five more times than the pro stocker because it's a "glide" clutch. "Fingers" on glide clutches are pre set by the pit crew in accordance to track conditions and weather. This pressure is predetermined and there is no "popping" the clutch off the line on a fuel car. It's not touched off the line because it "glides" or feathers itself determined by spring pressure. You get many more runs on a "pedal" clutch as opposed to a "glide" clutch where they change the clutch after one run on a fuel car generating 9-10,000 hp. And these clutches can cost upwards of 12-14,000 bucks. Now if a car in a ball park 2000 hp range can last 5 or 6 weeks of weekend competition, can you equate to a 40 hp geared tractor lasting a bit longer? This is getting silly. Can you just admit your determination of "ticking time bomb" for a tractor clutch was a bit dramatic?

 

[Piston]

Hello all, I have a small place of about 40 acres, about 1/2 woods and 1/2 terraced pasture. I am looking for a tractor for general use. I will not be tilling for the most part. I will be bushhogging, finish mowing, dirt/rock moving, driveway work, landscaping, etc. I would like a front end loader and a backhoe attachment, as well as a fork lift loader. I'm not getting this for 40-50 hours a week use, rather 5-10 hours a week maybe, give or take... I have looked at the Mahindra and Kubota models, and there seem to be several that would fit the bill. For my use, I cannot justify a John Deere... I have gotten several recommendations for the Mahindras for warranty as well as lack of problems, etc... I am leaning toward the 5010 Gear model. Does anyone have any recommendations? Any comments on the Mahindra model or possibly a better model for my use? I would appreciate any information! Thanks Guys!

I don't blame you for not replying. This thread went to chit in a short amount of time. Your better off starting another thread and let this useless one carry on.

 

[arrow]

I don't blame you for not replying. This thread went to chit in a short amount of time. Your better off starting another thread and let this useless one carry on.

It did but it was important to carry this out a bit in fairness to the op as a main assertion was a bit wild and could have prevented the op from making a correct decision for himself. So in that fact, I don't think it was "useless". There may have been some useless anecdotes sprinkled throughout but that's TBN with any posting. Hopefully things have been set straight at this point and the op can choose gear or hydro based on personal preference and not fear of breakdown….cheez..

 

[Gallo]

I think we should get out the measuring tape right now.... jesus

 

[MinnesotaEric]

So you're using a clutch intended for use in a racing/high performance manner, which, through it's use, is destined, if not designed, to fail, as an example for the life of a clutch on a piece of utility equipment?

No, I illustrated that clutch life is dependent upon the type of use. I illustrated the idea one one end with my first truck that went 200,000 miles before needing its first clutch, and on the other end, a racing clutch that needed to be replaced every third weekend. The intent of the illustration is to demonstrate that clutch life is always determined by the type of use. In other words, say a guy has a 4000 series John Deere crop row tractor that weights 10,000-13,000 pounds and has 95 PTO hp and all the owner has used it for is mowing his lawn. The clutch life on such a machine is likely to be way up there because the tractor's driveline is never taxed. Yet the illustration of a high hour crop row tractor is not a good illustration of expected clutch life because the equipment is underutilized and not used to its designed capability. That was my point.

I'll say it again for clarity: my racing clutch was simply an illustration how short a life of clutch can be on one extreme end of a range of expected life.

 

[newbury]

Why gear? You like pushing in a clutch? You like the clutch replacement time bomb?
<snip>

Time bomb?
at 5 to 10 hours per week?

Hello all,

I have a small place of about 40 acres, about 1/2 woods and 1/2 terraced pasture.

I am looking for a tractor for general use. I will not be tilling for the most part. I will be bushhogging, finish mowing, dirt/rock moving, driveway work, landscaping, etc.

I would like a front end loader and a backhoe attachment, as well as a fork lift loader.

I'm not getting this for 40-50 hours a week use, rather 5-10 hours a week maybe, give or take...

I have looked at the Mahindra and Kubota models, and there seem to be several that would fit the bill. For my use, I cannot justify a John Deere...

I have gotten several recommendations for the Mahindras for warranty as well as lack of problems, etc...

I am leaning toward the 5010 Gear model.

Does anyone have any recommendations? Any comments on the Mahindra model or possibly a better model for my use?

I would appreciate any information!

Thanks Guys!

My first truck went over 200,000 before it needed a clutch, while my last track toy needed a clutch every third weekend. It depends on how you use. Luddites fear industrial change and specifically, technological change. If my intent was to call people pushing back against a CVT or HST transmission, small-minded, I would have selected a different word.

At any-rate, while possible, long intervals between clutch changes are not normative unless the machine is under-utililized in its capacity to work or sits around.

That said, it is easier to use a CVT or HST transmission.

Reads like what he was describing.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

Time bomb?
at 5 to 10 hours per week?



Reads like what he was describing.

Fair enough.

He also said he wants to do loader work.

 

[Guesseral]

Ok maybe the OP can get back in now. I agree if you can afford it 40HP or more would probably be in your best interest but that is only my opinion. I also have a geared tractor four of them actually I really never even gave an HST any thought when I bought in 2010 gear was what was on the lot and that was what I bought. I have a loader and I use it a lot more that I ever thought I would yea believe it or not even with a gear tractor. Would an HST tractor be easier to use of course it would does it make a difference to me nope I like what I like and you should get what you want no matter what it is its your choice not mine and not anyone else's either. I think the LS is probably your best choice but my tractor was made by LS so I could be a little bias-ish but most tractors are pretty good and will last you a good long time.

I did think about a Chinese tractor when I started looking to update but this site steered me away from them, it just seemed to be a crap shoot to me some of them seem to be ok but some were just a real problem it would be up to you, you could get a good one and save a lot of money but then again you could go the other way and get a bad one and spend even more in the long than if you bought a better known brand in the first place. I don't like to use the "quality" or "better quality" or "lesser quality" labels because well because I have no proof for or against anyone of them all I know is what I have and every manufacturer can have good ones and or bad ones remember the Monday or Friday builds scenario.

What you need to do is go out and drive some of em play around with them, get what you like that you can afford and what fits your needs. We can only point you in the direction that we feels is the right one for us that is. Listening to us on TBN has its plusses and its minuses there is a lot of good information here there are even more opinions and everyone's own opinion is the only right one to them. Just remember this "I can't remember anyone ever complaining about buying a tractor with too much HP" that is one statement seen here many many times still doesn't make it right!

Have fun!

 

[Gallo]

What i don't get is why deere went the route they did... They went from making their own 4 family tractor to rebadging Yanmar tractors with different fenders and JD flare. Just take a look at the underpinnings of a yanmar tractor and the new 4 family identical. So it kills me to read checking out Chinese tractors when in fact JD is more Japanese these days than anything else.

I am too in the market for a 4x20 series over the next couple weeks and i can tell you i wont be buying an M or R series tractor and at a premium no less.

just upsetting

 

[newbury]

What i don't get is why deere went the route they did... They went from making their own 4 family tractor to rebadging Yanmar tractors with different fenders and JD flare. Just take a look at the underpinnings of a yanmar tractor and the new 4 family identical. So it kills me to read checking out Chinese tractors when in fact JD is more Japanese these days than anything else.

I am too in the market for a 4x20 series over the next couple weeks and i can tell you i wont be buying an M or R series tractor and at a premium no less.

just upsetting

BUT John Deere is an AMERICAN company!

That's why I like Kubota, as far as I know it's all Kubota.

 

[FatTire]

Mahindra 5035, 3550 or Kubota MX5100 or 5200 or L4760. Any of these will work for you. Set in the seat, drive them, get the one that is the most comfortable for you. Get 2-3 rear remotes and loader 3rd function hydraulics on whatever unit you choose. You will need them before you are done.

Good luck

2 or 3 remotes and 3rd function remote is good advice. I got 2 remotes and couldn't imagine why I'd need more than that. Now I need a 3rd function for the FEL or at minimum a 3rd rear remote. Don't skimp on this one.

 

[WM75Guy]

Consider all the things you need to do, all the things you might want to do in the future, and set a realistic budget. I don't use engine HP to determine what size I need, I prefer to look at the implements and their PTO HP needs. Also consider what you want to lift with the front end loader. Moving dirt or rocks in the bucket will not task your loader. It's when you decide to use pallet forks to move that pallet of stuff that weights 2000 pounds or lift that 1200-1500 pound round bale with a hay spear to stack them two high and discover you can only lift 1200 pounds at the pins. You may need to get the next size up model with a few more HP to get that next size up loader or a few extra PTO HP to drive that baler, log splitter, etc.

The overall weight of the tractor is also important. The tires will usually spin because of not enough weight rather than not having enough power to pull the load. The transmission has already been discussed some. For pulling in a field gears are fine and don't rob HP. For loader work HST make it easier but a gear with power shuttle works pretty good too. A CVT is like a car, you have gas pedal, brake pedal, and a forward/reverse power shuttle. You will probably end up compromising on one feature or another as there is not a perfect tractor for all situations.

 

[TSO]

What i don't get is why deere went the route they did... They went from making their own 4 family tractor to rebadging Yanmar tractors with different fenders and JD flare. Just take a look at the underpinnings of a yanmar tractor and the new 4 family identical. So it kills me to read checking out Chinese tractors when in fact JD is more Japanese these days than anything else.

I am too in the market for a 4x20 series over the next couple weeks and i can tell you i wont be buying an M or R series tractor and at a premium no less.

just upsetting

I wouldn't worry too much about that. Japan usually builds some good tractors. Sounds like JD has been affiliated with Yanmar for quite awhile.

Shibaura is Japanese and built for New Holland, Iseki is Japanese and builds my Massey, Kubota is obviously Japanese, and they make decent tractors.

S Korea builds good tractors too ... but like many say on here, sounds best to stay away from Chinese brands.

 

[ljohnson778]

No, I illustrated that clutch life is dependent upon the type of use. I illustrated the idea one one end with my first truck that went 200,000 miles before needing its first clutch, and on the other end, a racing clutch that needed to be replaced every third weekend. The intent of the illustration is to demonstrate that clutch life is always determined by the type of use. In other words, say a guy has a 4000 series John Deere crop row tractor that weights 10,000-13,000 pounds and has 95 PTO hp and all the owner has used it for is mowing his lawn. The clutch life on such a machine is likely to be way up there because the tractor's driveline is never taxed. Yet the illustration of a high hour crop row tractor is not a good illustration of expected clutch life because the equipment is underutilized and not used to its designed capability. That was my point. I'll say it again for clarity: my racing clutch was simply an illustration how short a life of clutch can be on one extreme end of a range of expected life.

Isn't that kinda like saying don't use goodyear tires on your honda civic, because they only last a couple hundred miles on a NASCAR vehicle?

 

[MinnesotaEric]

Isn't that kinda like saying don't use goodyear tires on your honda civic, because they only last a couple hundred miles on a NASCAR vehicle?

No, it is like saying tire life is dependent upon the type of use.

 

[arlen4720]

What i don't get is why deere went the route they did... They went from making their own 4 family tractor to rebadging Yanmar tractors with different fenders and JD flare. Just take a look at the underpinnings of a yanmar tractor and the new 4 family identical. So it kills me to read checking out Chinese tractors when in fact JD is more Japanese these days than anything else.

I am too in the market for a 4x20 series over the next couple weeks and i can tell you i wont be buying an M or R series tractor and at a premium no less.

just upsetting

The 4 series are not made by Yanmar. Deere just quit using their own John Deere Powertech engines in them and switched to Yanmar engines in them. The reason was tier 4. John Deere will be focusing on engines 75 hp and larger, and using Yanmars for the smaller ones. They started puting Yanmar engines in their skid loaders this year too. They are still building the smaller Powertech engines for stationary power equipment.
I was sorry to see the JD engine go too, but the Yanmars are good engines of course. The only JD CUT's that are made by Yanmar are the 2 series, but they all have a Yanmar engine in them now.

 

[SPYDERLK]

My 4020 has 9500+ hours with the original clutch. When the time comes to overhaul the engine, the clutch will be swapped out as well.

Ill guess that it is not a loader tractor, you are very sparing of clutch use, and your rivets are touching.
larry

 

[adirondackmtnman]

The 4 series are not made by Yanmar. Deere just quit using their own John Deere Powertech engines in them and switched to Yanmar engines in them. The reason was tier 4. John Deere will be focusing on engines 75 hp and larger, and using Yanmars for the smaller ones. They started puting Yanmar engines in their skid loaders this year too. They are still building the smaller Powertech engines for stationary power equipment.
I was sorry to see the JD engine go too, but the Yanmars are good engines of course. The only JD CUT's that are made by Yanmar are the 2 series, but they all have a Yanmar engine in them now.

Does that apply to the 50xx series as well? Darn shame to see those smaller powertechs go if so.

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[gbarrett38363]

Thanks for all the info here guys..... We'll be looking at different tractors in the next few weeks and I will let you know what were narrowing it down to... I will shout if I have more questions! You flks have a great weekend!