synthetic oil help generator start better???

[buickanddeere]

Synthetic will reduce the drag that mineral oil would present at the same temperature.

 

[ray66v]

Synthetic will reduce the drag that mineral oil would present at the same temperature.

Not substantially.

If you compare the spec's, the difference in lubricity is not that much.

It's not your fathers mineral oil anymore.

I did say he should use synthetic oil in his generator. It just isn't going to solve this problem.

 

[buickanddeere]

I'll stick with a real class IV synthetic in cold weather, high temp applications, short duty stop start applications, generators and pumps that start and run to full rpm and air cooled engines.

 

[daybreak1998]

Howdy,

Running synthetic oil in your generator certainly will not break the bank. It's not like it will use 5 gallons...

synthetic and dino oil will run very similar per spec. If you are in the very artic area and plan to need to use the generator and it's -20 degrees out, then you would use the appropriate weight oil. The same thing would apply for someone towards the equator, and the coolest weather they see is maybe 70 degrees, but they need the generator when the average temp is 100 degrees, you would use a heavier weight oil.

Buy some synthetic oil with the proper weight for your area, a oil change won't hurt.

Starting problems... ummm started fine the first few years.... ummm gasoline issues. I would suggest you siphon out as much gas as possible, put that into your car, buy some fresh gas, add a treatment, and run the generator at least an hour with load, and then top off the gasoline again.

 

[Texasmark]

Many people "feel" they can tell a definite difference between synthetic oil, and mineral oil.

But, from a scientific standpoint, if you look up the specifications, there is not a significant viscosity difference between a quality mineral oil, and a synthetic oil, until it gets really cold. (Or, really hot).

There is also no longer a significant difference in lubricity either.

If it gets really cold, or really hot, there is a basis for there to be a difference. In normal conditions, there is not. And. that has been what I have experienced.

One example was back in my 1988 Ford 5L V8. Using dino oil of the same viscosity, and always filling the new filter with oil prior to installation, just before the oil pressure gauge would jump up to registering, for a split second I could hear dry lifter rattle. I changed to syn and using the same changing interval, viscosity and all I never heard it again.

So much for data.

Mark

 

[ray66v]

One example was back in my 1988 Ford 5L V8. Using dino oil of the same viscosity, and always filling the new filter with oil prior to installation, just before the oil pressure gauge would jump up to registering, for a split second I could hear dry lifter rattle. I changed to syn and using the same changing interval, viscosity and all I never heard it again.

So much for data.

Mark

Yes, people who have the same tractor as me, have occasionally reported they noticed all kinds of differences when they switched to synthetic oil. I use the exact same products, and it did not make any difference what so ever, in it, or any other application I used it in.

Having driven lots of different vehicles over the years, I have had noises can come, and go, for no reason either.

I use Sea Foam on occasion, and have seen it work wonders. However, some TBN members, insist it does nothing.

Your perception is your reality. But, not necessarily a reality for anyone else.

 

[Texasmark]

Yes, people who have the same tractor as me, have occasionally reported they noticed all kinds of differences when they switched to synthetic oil. I use the exact same products, and it did not make any difference what so ever, in it, or any other application I used it in.

Having driven lots of different vehicles over the years, I have had noises can come, and go, for no reason either.

I use Sea Foam on occasion, and have seen it work wonders. However, some TBN members, insist it does nothing.

Your perception is your reality. But, not necessarily a reality for anyone else.

That's true and I reference my remarks, like if it's an experience of mine I say so meaning it worked for me or didn't. If a spec out of a manual I say that too; not necessarily agreeing with it, just stating what's in the book. Agree on what works for the gander might not work for the goose, but then again it just might.

I used Sea Foam in my 2 cycle OB in every tank. One day I had nothing to do and had several 2 cycle machines that were old, quit running and replaced them. In Short order using nothing more than fresh fuel and a significant amount of SF I got the tiller, chain saw, and weedeater all running to suit me. Was surprised SF made that much difference.

Mark

 

[Texasmark]

Yes, people who have the same tractor as me, have occasionally reported they noticed all kinds of differences when they switched to synthetic oil. I use the exact same products, and it did not make any difference what so ever, in it, or any other application I used it in.

Having driven lots of different vehicles over the years, I have had noises can come, and go, for no reason either.

I use Sea Foam on occasion, and have seen it work wonders. However, some TBN members, insist it does nothing.

Your perception is your reality. But, not necessarily a reality for anyone else.

That's true and I reference my remarks, like if it's an experience of mine I say so meaning it worked for me or didn't. If a spec out of a manual I say that too; not necessarily agreeing with it, just stating what's in the book. Agree on what works for the gander might not work for the goose, but then again it just might.

I used Sea Foam in my 2 cycle OB in every tank. One day I had nothing to do and had several 2 cycle machines that were old, quit running and replaced them. In Short order using nothing more than fresh fuel and a significant amount of SF I got the tiller, chain saw, and weedeater all running to suit me. Was surprised SF made that much difference.

Mark

 

[namesray]

took the generator apart down to the carb/choke area. checked the choke for full closing and such. it appeared to close properly and all the external linkage to the choke looked to work properly as well.

next, inspected the spark plug. looked good right out from engine, but wire brushed point anyway. then checked the gap. book says .030 inches and the gap on the plug was much tighter then that, so I gapped it at .030". at 68*f temp, it fired up on the second pull. that kinda surprised me it started that quick, but it was warm out. don't know if it was the plug or not. I will buy a new plug that is spec'd for colder running. (book states 3 different plugs for generator all for different temps. still don't know if that might help.)

as for my original idea of switching to synthetic helping, here is the stories I heard of going from conventional oil to synthetic.

one guy told me that he put mobile 1 synthetic in his lawn mower after only running conventional oil in it. the mowers throttle had a "notch" in it where he always run the throttle. immediately after he fired his mower up after putting the synthetic in, the engine was running at much higher rpms at that same notch, he had to back down the throttle to put the rpms back to where they were when the conventional oil was in it.

my friend told me that he switched to ams oil synthetic in his 2005 gmc truck (5.3l) and went from 16-18 mpg (conventional oil) to now, 19-22mpg (synthetic oil).

both people indicated the synthetic oil must create less drag on engine parts, thus their improvements and hence my idea of the synthetic oil creating less drag and helping the generator roll over easier and start easier.??..

 

[ray66v]

took the generator apart down to the carb/choke area. checked the choke for full closing and such. it appeared to close properly and all the external linkage to the choke looked to work properly as well.

next, inspected the spark plug. looked good right out from engine, but wire brushed point anyway. then checked the gap. book says .030 inches and the gap on the plug was much tighter then that, so I gapped it at .030". at 68*f temp, it fired up on the second pull. that kinda surprised me it started that quick, but it was warm out. don't know if it was the plug or not. I will buy a new plug that is spec'd for colder running. (book states 3 different plugs for generator all for different temps. still don't know if that might help.)

as for my original idea of switching to synthetic helping, here is the stories I heard of going from conventional oil to synthetic.

one guy told me that he put mobile 1 synthetic in his lawn mower after only running conventional oil in it. the mowers throttle had a "notch" in it where he always run the throttle. immediately after he fired his mower up after putting the synthetic in, the engine was running at much higher rpms at that same notch, he had to back down the throttle to put the rpms back to where they were when the conventional oil was in it.

my friend told me that he switched to ams oil synthetic in his 2005 gmc truck (5.3l) and went from 16-18 mpg (conventional oil) to now, 19-22mpg (synthetic oil).

both people indicated the synthetic oil must create less drag on engine parts, thus their improvements and hence my idea of the synthetic oil creating less drag and helping the generator roll over easier and start easier.??..

By all means try it, it's only a few bucks more.

But, as I have said, if you check the actual specifications, and compare them, you will not see enough difference in any of them, to explain substantial differences in performance. Except in extreme temperatures.

The people who make synthetic oil, do not promise mileage increases like that. Wouldn't they, if it was true?

I have tried Amsoil, and Mobil 1 in several pieces of equipment, it made no noticeable difference for me.

Synthetic oil technology is not the only oil technology that has evolved. All quality oils use the latest, and greatest additives.

People often make claims such as, using higher octane gas, gives you more power, and thus better mileage too. Any gas supplier will tell you that is not true. Once someone decides they believe something like that is true, most are not going to change their minds.

 

[QueBota]

I document all fuel and miles driven in my 2001.5 Ram Cummins, I pick up a little over 1 mpg running Mobil 1 5w-40. Now at approx 140K, fuel mileage is still increasing slightly. During warmer weather I can avg. over 20.5 miles per tank. Engine is also a bit quiter with Mobil 1 and seems to spin up a bit more freely, not to mention easier winter starts. Also, oil temp runs approx. 10 degrees F cooler.

Q

 

[namesray]

Over the last couple months I have messed with this generator to try to get it to start better. Once winter set in, it wouldnt start. Changed spark plug, didnt help.

Finally took it to a guy, and he adjusted the valves. This morning, at zero degrees f, started on second pull. I never would have guess valve adj.

As for if the synthetic oil would help it start, roll over easier, I now dont believe so at all. Just figure I let ya all know. Thanks again for all rsponses.

 

[Copperhead]

My portable generator has to ride in a box on the frame rail of my semi truck in the cold. It starts fine all the time when I need it. I use the Amsoil 10w30 4 stroke oil in it. Great for year round use. I use the same oil in my John Deere zero turn and a couple of other applications, so having it on hand for the generator is just another use.

 

[davesl708]

Over the last couple months I have messed with this generator to try to get it to start better. Once winter set in, it wouldnt start. Changed spark plug, didnt help.

Finally took it to a guy, and he adjusted the valves. This morning, at zero degrees f, started on second pull. I never would have guess valve adj.

As for if the synthetic oil would help it start, roll over easier, I now dont believe so at all. Just figure I let ya all know. Thanks again for all rsponses.

namesray, do your own test. When I lived up north and temps were routinely below 0f my car started much easier with syn.

Get a cup of the same weight oil in both dino and syn. Put them in the freezer overnight. Then set both cups on a board or tray and tip them over at the same time. See which one runs to the bottom first. Simple test that will show which will flow through your cold engine the best.

 

[Copperhead]

Yeah, in cold, synthetics are king. Well, even in heat. Whether one realizes the true benefit of them, that is for each person to figure out. I picked the 10w30/30w Amsoil 4 stroke stuff because it is a straight 30w, with no viscosity improvers, that also qualifies as a 10w30 because of the cold flow synthetic characteristics. Stuff is real stout. Does a great job on my smaller engines. And since we are not talking about mass quantities of the stuff needed, it is pretty cost effective even on a tight budget.

 

[ray66v]

namesray, do your own test. When I lived up north and temps were routinely below 0f my car started much easier with syn.

Get a cup of the same weight oil in both dino and syn. Put them in the freezer overnight. Then set both cups on a board or tray and tip them over at the same time. See which one runs to the bottom first. Simple test that will show which will flow through your cold engine the best.

Nothing I have ever changed to synthetic, has started noticeably better.

Mobil1 10w30 synthetic, minimum pour point, -42F
Valvoline 10w30 conventional, minimum pour point -36F
Similar results are also there for lubricity.

Yes, the synthetic is better. But, it's 2015, there is no substantial difference anymore, until you get to the extremes. At 0 degrees F, the differences are still minimal.

I have to put 20w50 synthetic oil in aircraft engines in the winter all the time. Even at 20F, it doesn't want to come out of the bottle.

 

[Copperhead]

Well, it is not the same components, but my semi truck transmission and diffs automatically get the warranty extended by the OEM from 500,000 miles to 750,000 miles if synthetics are used in them. So there must be some sort of benefit or the OEM's (Eaton and Meritor) would not extend the warranty by 50%. And that has nothing to do with cold, hot, north, south, anything.

But you are also comparing a 10w30 across the board. Of course they are similar in cold flow pour point, after all, they are both 10w30! But you sure will not find a conventional 5w30 or 0w30, and those will pour at cold temps that will have a conventional performing like grease. And my comment on what I use, it is a straight 30w Amsoil. But it performs like a 10w30 even though it is not a 10w30. It needs no viscosity improvers to perform equally with a 10w30. Find a conventional straight 30w that has a cold flow pour point of -36F. Not going to happen. But a straight 30w synthetic will. And what of viscosity improvers? You need substantially more VI to make a conventional 10w30 than a synthetic version. And VI is what shears and breaks down under pressure. Some applications can really make a motor oil scream for mercy because it shears the VI's in a nasty way. I had a Delo 400 LE 15w40 do that in my Detroit Series 60.

There is a lot more going on with an oil than just whether it is a conventional or synthetic. It is a package thing. You have to take all factors about an oil into account as to whether it is better performing than another. The base oil is just one piece of the puzzle.

 

[ray66v]

Again, not saying the synthetic oil isn't better.

Extreme temps, and longer intervals. Clearly the synthetic has the advantage.

However, under normal conditions, the specifications show, much of the fabled "difference" is no longer there.


I am familiar with Amsoil ACD. And have used it.

 

[MossRoad]

Isn't 5w30 dyno oil the same viscosity as 5w30 synthetic? Its 5 viscosity when its cold and its 30 viscosity when its hot? So if the OP puts the exact same weight synthetic oil in instead of dyno oil, it will probably do nothing for cold weather starting, as it will be just as thick.

It has nothing to do with the benefits of synthetic oil when it comes to wear and longevity, which is a completely different subject.

Here's a good read on viscosity....
Motor Oil Viscosity Grades Explained in Layman's Terms

 

[MHarryE]

Isn't 5w30 dyno oil the same viscosity as 5w30 synthetic? Its 5 viscosity when its cold and its 30 viscosity when its hot? So if the OP puts the exact same weight synthetic oil in instead of dyno oil, it will probably do nothing for cold weather starting, as it will be just as thick. It has nothing to do with the benefits of synthetic oil when it comes to wear and longevity, which is a completely different subject. Here's a good read on viscosity.... Motor Oil Viscosity Grades Explained in Layman's Terms

As you read in the link attached, dino oils need VI (viscosity improvement) additives to make, for example, a 10 oil into a 10W-30. With time, temperature, and pressure, these additives shear down and you can be left with the lower number oil all the time. Good quality synthetic oils do not need viscosity enhancers and therefore are not subject to shear down so a 5W-40 oil will remain 5W-40 after 500 hours just like it started out.