How much weight can I legally haul in Virginia without CDL.

[RandyT]

I have never seen a the manufacturer's GCWR enforced. If it was that critical, it would be listed on the door jam next to the axle capacity and tire specs.

I haven't either but they had a rash of dually pickups with 8000 pounds plates and GVWR of 9200-9600 there were pulled over and given over weight tickets, and were escorted to the DMV for replating to the 12000 pound plate, and then where given a ticket for failure to display a safety inspection sticker here in IL about 4 years ago.

 

[Diamondpilot]

I haven't either but they had a rash of dually pickups with 8000 pounds plates and GVWR of 9200-9600 there were pulled over and given over weight tickets, and were escorted to the DMV for replating to the 12000 pound plate, and then where given a ticket for failure to display a safety inspection sticker here in IL about 4 years ago.

What dully has 9600# GCWR? My F350 SRW 4x4 is 11,500# GVWR and my old F250 was 10,000# GVWR. Most dually trucks I have looked at are around 13,000#.

Chris

 

[newbury]

What dully has 9600# GCWR? My F350 SRW 4x4 is 11,500# GVWR and my old F250 was 10,000# GVWR. Most dually trucks I have looked at are around 13,000#.

Chris

Chris - Look at some older ones. '99 Fords were limited to 20K GCVWR and 10K tow.

For the OP - check this thread http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/trailers-transportation/231776-can-you-up-rate-new.html. I think if you keep it clean, well tied down, and look like you know what you are doing you won't be stopped. Just keep the CB on to lookout for when they are stopping EVERYBODY (orange alert, DUI checkpoints, etc.)

 

[LD1]

I laugh every time this comes up. The CDL requirement only comes into play when your F350 towing a gooseneck hauling your tractor with loader and box blade goes across the scales at 26,001 or more pounds.

If the combination of your truck + trailer+tractor doesn't weight more than 26,001 it doesn't matter what the trailer weighs. In other words your 9,000 pound truck can legally tow a trailer weighing 17,000 pounds without a CDL.

When I read about CDL requirements, they talk about GCWR's, Gross Combined Weight Ratings, not actual weights. By my understanding, it wouldn't matter if the trailer was empty.

Parkanzsky: that is my understanding too.

It Its about what its rated for, not what it actually weighs.

My truck is 12,200 GVWR. That means I cannot legally hook to a 14k rated trailer. Even just towing it around empty I am in violation of CDL laws. But I can tow a 12k trailer loaded to the max and be just fine.

 

[gwiley]

In Va I have been stopped by state troopers just because I was pulling a bobcat. ALthough it was for personal not business use they still like to make contact with you, especially if you are on back roads and they are having a slow day

The state troopers in Va have always been courteous to me but also professional and by the book even for non-commercial haulers. In Va you must have CDL to pull anything 26,001 and over.

 

[rswyan]

IF It's not for Commerce (making money) it doesn't matter, no CDL required.

Correct :thumbsup:

Some folks would do well to figure out what the "C" in "CDL" actually stands for ...

 

[FatTire]

I have never seen a the manufacturer's GCWR enforced. If it was that critical, it would be listed on the door jam next to the axle capacity and tire specs.

Maybe not in MN, but in Colorado they can use it to nail people in a non-commercial situation pulling what appears to be a questionable load over steep mountain passes. Goes back to what someone posted above, if you have an appropriate tow rig, load is well secured, and you're not doing anything stupid, its unlikely you will be stopped.

 

[Copperhead]

Yeah, if one is driving anything over 10,001 lb GCWR or GVWR for commercial reasons, the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration rules kick in (which all states have to subscribe to), and that is where the CDL game comes in. You can pull a 13,000 lb 5th wheel RV for pleasure without one, but if you are pulling one from the factory to the dealer, you are required to have a CDL, medical card (which is now computerized as part of the CDL), and log book (if over 100 air mile radius). Even the DOT has gotten on guys just moving their tractor and implement via roadway from one field to the other, because it crossed state lines, for not having a CDL. Yep, in a farm tractor pulling a planter or even a driving their combine! Goofy world we live in. As for personal stuff it is primarily left up to the individual states as to how and when they might require a CDL.

And any LEO that is doing weight checks and such regarding GVWR and GCWR, it is easy for them to run your VIN and check online right out of their car. Remember, you gave them your license, registration, and insurance card when they stopped you. They have all they need to see if you are legal.

True, they are not going to stop everyone. They are looking for key things as a reason to stop someone. Something looks out of place, you can bet their curiosity is going to be piqued and they are going to want to check. A loose chain and binder, a low tire, or any of a host of reasons. I operate a commercial semi truck, over 15 states, and I haven't been stopped and checked for almost 3 years. Not once since I bought my present semi truck in August of 2012. Crossed the scales and had weight checked, but that is it. Not one time in 3 years asked for paperwork, license, anything.

 

[LD1]

Correct :thumbsup:

Some folks would do well to figure out what the "C" in "CDL" actually stands for ...

If only that were true. I am pretty sure I cannot go buy a lowboy and tractor and tow 80k for my own personal needs (not commercial) without a CDL.

 

[LD1]

Yeah, if one is driving anything over 10,001 lb GCWR for commercial reasons, the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration rules kick in (which all states have to subscribe to), and that is where the CDL game comes in.

I believe the 10,001 is only for determining Class A or Class B. And only applies if the tow vehicle is over 26k.

IE: you can tow a 12k trailer with a 12k GVWR truck (one ton dually) and not have any issues.

BUT, if you have a 30k truck trailers over 10k need a CDL A. Trailers under 10K can get by with a CDL B

 

[rswyan]

If only that were true.

It is true ... no "if" needed ...

I am pretty sure I cannot go buy a lowboy and tractor and tow 80k for my own personal needs (not commercial) without a CDL.

The actual problem would come when you tried to register and plate it ...

Commercial registration and plates = commercial use ...

 

[rswyan]

I believe the 10,001 is only for determining Class A or Class B.

Nope ...

And only applies if the tow vehicle is over 26k.

Again, nope ...

 

[Diamondpilot]

Chris - Look at some older ones.<img src="http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/files/trailers-transportation/422823-how-much-weight-can-i-99tow-ratings-jpg"/> '99 Fords were limited to 20K GCVWR and 10K tow. For the OP - check this thread http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/trailers-transportation/231776-can-you-up-rate-new.html. I think if you keep it clean, well tied down, and look like you know what you are doing you won't be stopped. Just keep the CB on to lookout for when they are stopping EVERYBODY (orange alert, DUI checkpoints, etc.)

I had a 99 350 SRW 7.3 but I didn't realize the Dually was rated the same as a SRW truck.

Chris

 

[LD1]

Nope ...


Again, nope ...

Can you elaborate?

This whole CDL thing is as confusing to me as the tax code.

I have read and read more. I am currently looking into getting a CDL because everything tells me I need to. 12.2k GVWR truck, and a 12 ton GN trailer. By my understanding, I need a CDL regardless of my purpose for towing. And a CDL A to boot.

Following flow charts and reading various laws, the only time I see 10,001 mentioned is determining Class A or Class B when truck is over 26k.

Hard to imagine a guy with a 3/4 ton truck (or even these newer 1/2 tons) towing a 12k bumper pull trailer and needing a CDL of any kind.

 

[rswyan]

Can you elaborate?

Sure ... although I now understand you to have meant trailers (towed vehicle) rather than the towing vehicle when you referred to 10,001 requirement.

I was referring to the towing vehicle, not what is being towed.

Regardless, that is neither here nor there.

Basically any vehicle (used in commerce) over 10,001 lbs is considered to be a Commercial Motor Vehicle (aka) ... and is very highly regulated by the Feds.

Note that - for the Fed's (and probably most states) purposes - Commercial Motor Vehicle is not the same thing as a commercial vehicle ...

IOW, you can have a commercial vehicle (registered and plated) and not fall under the same regs as Commercial Motor Vehicles.

That describes my own personal situation (a van which has a GVWR of 8550 lbs - but is used in commerce and is registered and plated as a commercial vehicle)

I don't log or scale (except in certain rare states, Virginia being one)

This whole CDL thing is as confusing to me as the tax code.

Much misinformation exists out there that's for sure.

The following is from the Feds (Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration), and I have highlighted applicable/noteworthy portions:

Drivers have been required to have a commercial driver's license (CDL) in order to drive certain commercial motor vehicles (CMVs) since April 1, 1992. The types of vehicles and operations requiring a CDL are outlined below. The Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (FMCSA) has developed and issued standards for State testing and licensing of CDL holders. These standards require States to issue CDLs to certain CMV drivers only after the driver passes knowledge and skills tests administered by the State and related to the type of vehicle the driver expects to operate. Drivers are required to obtain and hold a CDL if they operate in interstate, intrastate, or foreign commerce and drive a vehicle that meets one or more of the classifications of a CMV described below. ...

You can read more at the link below:

Drivers - Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration

The relevant point (above) is that the requirement for a CDL is for drivers operating certain vehicles being used in commerce.

I have read and read more. I am currently looking into getting a CDL because everything tells me I need to. 12.2k GVWR truck, and a 12 ton GN trailer. By my understanding, I need a CDL regardless of my purpose for towing. And a CDL A to boot.

If you are driving/towing/hauling using that setup, then yes you do ... assuming that you are doing it for a commercial reason and are engaged in commerce ...

 

[schmism]

IF It's not for Commerce (making money) it doesn't matter, no CDL required.

as noted, CDL is an endorsement for commerce. You might rephrase your question "how much weight can i legally haul in VA on a standard class C/D license"

if this is your rig

assuming that trailer is over 10,001 lbs, and that FL60 has a GCWR over 26,001 (it does at something like 60,000 lbs depending on setup)

your going to need a class A license.


Put another way.

If your tow vehicle is GCWR less than 26,000... then you can haul up to that weight on a regular drivers license. 16K trailer on a 9999lb truck. a 11K trailer on a 14,999 truck etc

This is assuming all other ratings are met. (you actually have a trailer with a 16K GVWR, you dont exceed the RAWR of the tow vehicle etc)

 

[Charlie175]

Last fall I went to DMV (Virginia) and registered my Ram 2500. The lady asked what I was doing with it (Personal towing) and how much I wanted to tow (14k trailer).
She gave me plates to suit and noted since it was under 26k combined, my regular license was fine.
That was that.

 

[LD1]

If you are driving/towing/hauling using that setup, then yes you do ... assuming that you are doing it for a commercial reason and are engaged in commerce ...

My understanding is that I need a CDL even if NOT doing it for commerce. If I am towing a tractor to my house to a friends, I would still need a CDL.

From everything I have read, A 1-ton truck with a 24k GN trailer is no different than a semi w/53' box. No matter weather commercial or private.

 

[rswyan]

My understanding is that I need a CDL even if NOT doing it for commerce. If I am towing a tractor to my house to a friends, I would still need a CDL.

Yeah ... I "get" what your understanding is ...

From everything I have read, A 1-ton truck with a 24k GN trailer is no different than a semi w/53' box. No matter weather commercial or private.

Dunno where (or what) you're reading ... so I can't really comment on that ... other than to say on the face of it - without you providing additional qualifications - it's wrong.

If you have a source you'd like to cite, I'll be happy to have a look.

I've provided you with one source already - which is the ultimate Federal authority on CDL's - the United States Department of Transportation, Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration.

The only potential issue I can see is that the State of Ohio registers non-commercial trailers by unladen weight. They do this up to a unladen trailer weight of 10,000 lbs:

ODPS | BMV | Non Commercial Trailer Registration Fees

Unladen weight is different than GVWR .

So yeah ... if the unladen weight of your 24K GN exceeds 10,000 lbs., the State of Ohio will require you to register it as commercial, which opens the whole CDL can of worms.

 

[LD1]

The unladen weight is 6500#, but I think it is tagged as commercial. They didnt even ask me if I wanted comm or non-comm. And didnt realize til I got home and installed the plates. Renewal is up in a few months. Comm is cheaper, only ~$45. Going non-comm @ 6500# puts me $91.

I have done tons of reading at the cites you already posted. I still have yet to read anything that excludes a person from those weight restrictions if you are non-commercial.

If I understand YOU correctly,

1. You are saying that if truck and trailer are registered non-comm, and I am hauling for personal use, I am fine with no CDL.
2. But if registered comm, or hauling commercially, I need the CDL?
3. And if I had a trailer with a GVWR under 13.8k (12.2+13.8=26k) I wouldnt need a CDL regardless?

If only I could be certain.

Ohio's CDL flow chart looks the same as the one posted earlier.


Does the vehicle or combination of vehicles have a mfg weight rating over 26k? 12.2+24k=36.2k.............Yes
Is the vehicle a combination vehicle towing a unit with a GWVR over 10k.......YES

CDL A required

I see no exemptions for non-commercial use?

And there are a TON of other threads on the net all across the US Asking these same questions. A 1-ton with a dual tandem or triple axle GN require a CDL. And the general consensus is YES. And lots of people telling stories of being pulled over towing their old tractor from one farm to the next, or hauling cattle, etc.