1 Ton Dump Truck for Personal Use

[Reg]

Reg,

I was at a CDL driver's meeting about 2 years ago and they told me med card for 17K GVWR operated in state. If it goes out of state for commerce it drops way down in weight.

I think in PA he won't be required to have a med card for a 10K truck. I had an F-450 at 15,000lbs and was never asked to produce a med card at routine traffic stops.

The o/p's sig line says eastern mass and NY state, so I was guessing that he or family and property are scattered across the line.

Back around October of last year Mass started to get in line with federal and other states on inspections, which basically translated to anything over 10K GVW now has to have the full commercial vehicle inspection; carry chocks, flares, fire ex, etc. (& why wouldn't anyone ?) so that includes just about all duallies - -
I don't know about those SRW 1 tons deals, those seem kinda phishie to me.
As I understand it the med card is all/only about the vehicle's capacity and nothing about commercial/private use or plate type.
If he gets down to CT and goes through the Union weigh station they will give him "clarification" on all this - - and everything else.
A common sight down there is 1/2 and 3/4 ton trucks with 12K or 14K trailers carrying a mini ex. Guys on cell phones calling everyone they know to come and get their load with a bigger truck and/or trailer (I assume).

Union CT is NOT a "routine traffic stop" it isn't even a "routine weigh station".
I've had easier times crossing the country borders in Europe (-:

 

[crashz]

The o/p's sig line says eastern mass and NY state, so I was guessing that he or family and property are scattered across the line.

Back around October of last year Mass started to get in line with federal and other states on inspections, which basically translated to anything over 10K GVW now has to have the full commercial vehicle inspection; carry chocks, flares, fire ex, etc. (& why wouldn't anyone ?) so that includes just about all duallies - -
I don't know about those SRW 1 tons deals, those seem kinda phishie to me.
As I understand it the med card is all/only about the vehicle's capacity and nothing about commercial/private use or plate type.
If he gets down to CT and goes through the Union weigh station they will give him "clarification" on all this - - and everything else.
A common sight down there is 1/2 and 3/4 ton trucks with 12K or 14K trailers carrying a mini ex. Guys on cell phones calling everyone they know to come and get their load with a bigger truck and/or trailer (I assume).

Union CT is NOT a "routine traffic stop" it isn't even a "routine weigh station".
I've had easier times crossing the country borders in Europe (-:

Yep -you're right. I live in eastern MA near Boston, and we have land in western MA and upstate NY.

I bought a truck yesterday. 1986 GMC K35 diesel (6.2L yay!), auto, 4x4, with all new body panels. And a new cab. Frame is in good shape. Tire are good. Thr truck runs well but needs typical maintenance, especially the gow plug system. Fortunately I have many parts and more experience than I care to remember with the beloved 6.2L diesel. However for a truck that will see some highway mileage and that is NOT a daily driver, the 6.2L is a good choice. I'll have to get pics next weekend as its in Pittsfield. Actually I want to clean it up a bit for pics first. Its not perfect but got a lot of potential. Price was very fair too.

The former owner helped clarify the regs. The trucks has to be registered commercial in MA. It is probably best to obtain a Fed DOT number (especially for crossing state borders) however trucks at or over 10,001 lbs must have a federal (six month?) inspection sticker, and this is an 1986 K35 with a GVWR of 10,000 so it only need the yearly $29 MA safety inpsection. At the 10K lbs limit, the truck does not have to be lettered up for a business. All other "CDL truck" safety equipment I will carry regardless of requirements or not. Its just good practice to do so.

 

[Builder]

Amazing how regs are different state to state. NY state sounds like a real PITA to deal with compared to PA (which I thought was a PITA to deal with)

 

[smithrngr]

ny is a real pita do deal withi even have comerical plates and my f-250 weighted for only 9,000lb's.and the dot can and will yank you and check if you are hauling a load,we don't need chocks or anything like that.you can have pass plates but if you are cought with over 500lbs in the bed instant ticket for overload or hauling anything heavy.ask one of my friends he thought he was being smart and trying to not pay the high price for his reg and got nailed and it only cost him 300.00 to get out of it. where my plates cost my 120.00 for 2 years maby next time he will listen.i have a class a cdl but think you can a truck with no cdl with weight up to 25,000 or 26,00lbs before needing any cdl.my insurance has always been lower with com plates because the consider it a work truck is what they told me. the dot and state police have started nailing you if you have a uncovered load in the back,ie dirt mulch sand garbage stone because they say it can and will fly out and i agree with them mulch does fly pretty good, dump trucks to pick ups are getting tickests for the i see it all the time and just laugh.

 

[radioman]

yes NYS is PITA for registration and inspections.

 

[rvaitor]

I bought a refuse dump truck last month have about $4500 in it. Hope to use it for a while and sell it. I had a lot of trash left on the property and just couldn't bring myself to pay someone to load and haul it off. It was a county truck - pretty well maintained.

It a 96 F700 140K miles 7 litre engine, and I believe since it's single axle and electric brakes, a CDL is not required. I've put about 400 miles on it and so far it's been great. I have a few more loads and I'll see if one of the neighbors needs it and let it go. There are so many chicken houses around it might be good for moving chicken feed.

 

[Groo]

I've never heard of a DOT card for over 10k before. How could you rent a Uhaul without one then?
so I looked it up, and found this under fmcsa FAQ


"8. Are CMV drivers who operate in interstate commerce required to have a medical certificate? 129

Drivers are required to have a DOT Medical Certificate:

If they operate a motor vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), gross combination weight rating (GCWR), gross vehicle weight (GCW), or gross combination weight (GCW) of 4,536 kilograms or more in interstate commerce.

If they operate a motor vehicle designed or used to transport more than 15 passengers (including the driver) in interstate commerce.

If they operate a motor vehicle designed or used to transport between 9 and 15 passengers, for direct compensation, beyond 75 air miles from the driver's normal work-reporting location, in interstate commerce

If they transport hazardous materials, in a quantity requiring placards, in interstate commerce.

CFR 49 Part 391.41

CFR 49 Part 390.5"

notice the 10k lbs limit is for interstate comerce. I'd think you'd be fine for personal use up to the 26k non-CDL limit

 

[Duffster]

I bought a refuse dump truck last month have about $4500 in it. Hope to use it for a while and sell it. I had a lot of trash left on the property and just couldn't bring myself to pay someone to load and haul it off. It was a county truck - pretty well maintained.

It a 96 F700 140K miles 7 litre engine, and I believe since it's single axle and electric brakes, a CDL is not required. I've put about 400 miles on it and so far it's been great. I have a few more loads and I'll see if one of the neighbors needs it and let it go. There are so many chicken houses around it might be good for moving chicken feed.

CDL Requirements start at 26k

It has nothing to do with how many axles or what type of brakes, even if you electric

I've never heard of a DOT card for over 10k before. How could you rent a Uhaul without one then?
so I looked it up, and found this under fmcsa FAQ


"8. Are CMV drivers who operate in interstate commerce required to have a medical certificate? 129

Drivers are required to have a DOT Medical Certificate:

If they operate a motor vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), gross combination weight rating (GCWR), gross vehicle weight (GCW), or gross combination weight (GCW) of 4,536 kilograms or more in interstate commerce.

If they operate a motor vehicle designed or used to transport more than 15 passengers (including the driver) in interstate commerce.

If they operate a motor vehicle designed or used to transport between 9 and 15 passengers, for direct compensation, beyond 75 air miles from the driver's normal work-reporting location, in interstate commerce

If they transport hazardous materials, in a quantity requiring placards, in interstate commerce.

CFR 49 Part 391.41

CFR 49 Part 390.5"

notice the 10k lbs limit is for interstate comerce. I'd think you'd be fine for personal use up to the 26k non-CDL limit

Some states require you to meet FMCSA requirements even for intrastate commmerce, some have a 17k cutoff and some are the same as CDL requirements.

It may be easier to comply than to prove it is for personal use

 

[jimmysisson]

I think the goal is a unified national standard, so that trucking interstate does not involve complying with differing rules. The MA updates last fall affect our ｾ ton pickups with dump trailer loaded. We're getting around to complying...
Jim

 

[Harold_J]

Amazing how regs are different state to state. NY state sounds like a real PITA to deal with compared to PA (which I thought was a PITA to deal with)

Yes, NY can be a pain at times but in this case they seem to be similar to Mass. They want commercial plates on the dump truck and they're not that expensive. Actually NY is getting better in some respects. They used to want you to have a higher license for over 18K until just a few years ago. Now you can drive up to 26K straight truck or 36K trailer combo with a regular license, so they're now in-line with the normal CDL requirements.

Crashz was very lucky to find that 86 truck rated at 10,000 MGVW. That will eliminate all the DOT numbers and regs etc. I am holding onto a 1973 C35 Chev stake body dually that's in good shape for the same reason. I wish they would still sell a new truck like that 10K dually. They usually came new with Load Range D tires but haul a lot nicer than a SRW. 1986 must have been right around the cutoff when the duallys started going over 10k. Since they've now got the F450's and 4500's you would think they could offer a 350/3500 dually rated at 10K; I think there would be a market for it. GM seems to be concious of the DOT situation in NY, CA and other states is since they rate the SRW 3500 right at 9900#.

As someone else said I think we need more uniformity in the regs from state to state. 10,000 lbs is way too low to kick in all of those DOT regs. If I put 2 bins of pumpkins in my F350 pickup and drive from NY to PA the DOT stuff comes into play. In my opinion I think something in the range of 18,000-26,000 lbs would make more sense. And what is the big deal about crossing state lines, safe is safe and unsafe is unsafe.

I think they jumped on this 10K bandwagon in NY after the 9-11 terror attacks, but there has to be a better way for tracking these small trucks. (Or maybe it's a revenue maker??).

 

[amigauser]

Looks like CT adopted the federal regs.
DMV: U.S. DOT Number Assignment for Intrastate Carriers

License types in CT.
DMV: New Classification of Licenses

Info PDF file.
http://www.ct.gov/dmv/LIB/dmv/20/29/mch.pdf

Like someone else mentioned - 10,001 is the magic number for interstate and 18,001 for intrastate in CT. Below that and you are good. I see a lot of trucks advertised here less than 26,000 but even then the 18,001 number would kick in.

 

[Wis Bang]

Looks like CT adopted the federal regs.
DMV: U.S. DOT Number Assignment for Intrastate Carriers

License types in CT.
DMV: New Classification of Licenses

Info PDF file.
http://www.ct.gov/dmv/LIB/dmv/20/29/mch.pdf

Like someone else mentioned - 10,001 is the magic number for interstate and 18,001 for intrastate in CT. Below that and you are good. I see a lot of trucks advertised here less than 26,000 but even then the 18,001 number would kick in.

Most states have adopted the Federal regulations 'in toto' though the level of enforcement varies.

I had a boss who thought the exemption for 'delivery' drivers to NJ's seatbelt laws also covered CDL CMV drivers until he was shown the federal regs and then he realized it only covered guys like UPS drivers, milk men, etc. and UPS guys have to follow company policy and use them anyway...

 

[dgl24087]

In VA, USPS contract drivers who drive box trucks are exempt from CDL requirements for weight, air brake endorsements and medical card, as long as the assigned route is not longer than 75 miles from their terminal, i.e. the post office. Also exempt are bulk newspaper delivery drivers, same mileage restriction. My primary vehicle is a Mitsubishi Fuso, 24' box with air over hydraulic brakes, 7.5L diesel , inline 6 with a 6 spd. manual. Out of 12 trucks, 5 are Fuso's, mileage ranging from 150,000 to 500,000 miles, and 7 are International 4300 (3) and 4700's (4). The 4700's (all Allisons) have 120,000 to 170,000 miles and spend a significant amount of time in the shop. Problems have ranged from leaking rear axles, 3 transmission failures, to one blown engine. The 4300's have been good trucks so far, 1 is an Allison, the other two are manuals (1 Eaton Fuller 6 spd. and 1 Eaton Fuller 7 spd.). All of the Internationals have DT466's. None of the Fuso's have had any significant issues, 4 are 6 spd. manuals and 1 is an Allison AT. The Fuso in my avatar consistently gets 11-13 mpg's regardless of load or driver. The Internationals get about 7-8 mpgs.

 

[DMF]

so it only need the yearly $29 MA safety inpsection.

I think you're going to find that the $29 inspection fee goes up to $100 per year for 10K GVW since the change in laws this past October... Good luck!

 

[jimmysisson]

A friend just had his 12K trailer inspected (Mass.). Trailer is a couple years old and he's meticulous. MA $29 inspection fee, + $75 for an "hour" (12 minutes actual) to check for rust, bad brakes, breakaway, chains, etc. The hour charge is the default minimum. They're supposed to pull each brake for visual inspection, check all lights, etc. Not too bad a price if inspector is thorough, but annoying if he assumes all's well. This inspector assumed.
When I was a kid I hoped the inspectors would be lazy or lenient. Now I want them to be careful and look at everything. Sometimes you want someone else's eyes on stuff you get used to seeing all the time.
Jim

 

[Diamondpilot]

Glad I do not live on the East Coast for many reasons but the inspection thing is just a money making gimmick!

Chris

 

[dan6399]

in mass you can register a 1 ton as a personal vehicle just dont letter it,one ton dump is no different than a 1 ton pick up and being in ma myself i have seen a lot of 1 ton dumps,people haVE no money to keep them

I have a GMC 3500 Pickup. I had the dealership register it with passenger plates when I bought it two years ago. I get pulled over a month ago and the cop tells me that it needs to be commercal plates. I did some research and all trucks with more than 4 wheels on the ground and over 10,000 gvw needs to be commercial. It costs about $190 every year for registration as well as $130 for a inspection sticker. I live in and got pulled over in Plymouth Massachuasetts. Hope this helps.

 

[Builder]

Glad I do not live on the East Coast for many reasons but the inspection thing is just a money making gimmick!

Chris

I'm glad I live on the east coast for a lot of reasons and one is vehicle safety inspections.

90% of owner operators of large trucks & trailers are safety concious, responsible people. The other 10% are too cheap or stupid to check their brakes, suspensions & steering for wear or too dumb to know how. The safety inspection program is a safety net to keep the 10% from taking out innocent people in crashes. I was witness to one. Horrific scene to say the least.

Buddy of mine is an inspection mechanic for a fleet of steel company trucks and does a lot of work on the side on my trucks & equipment, too. I have personally seen an old Dodge stakebody brought in with bailing wire holding the steering tie rods together. When i bought my 4800 from a dealer in Tennessee, the front airbrakes were actually disconnected.

Yes, it's a hassle to deal with, but it keeps the roads safer. My state has no diesel emmissions inspections, so that makes life easier compared to other states that do.

 

[atgreene]

The truck has to be registered for the maximum weight, including trailer, for which it may haul.

When you reg it you will see that it is expensive. You also need a state DOT # for over 10k lbs. They sometimes do not ask you for this when you reg, but the nice DOT Commercial Vehicle Enforcement man will ask you why you don't have one when he does a force roadside inspection and sets it on the scales just before he writes you a ticket.

As for a 1 ton rated at 10k, good luck with that. The truck alone must weigh 9k lbs. Doesn't leave much for payload. You get caught over the weight and you're done for.

Also, insurance, call your insurance co. and let them know what your planning, they may have other thoughts, Geico isn't big on insuring commercial trucks.

Owning a commercial vehicle is expensive, I get customers tell me all the time it seems like a lot of money for delivery charges, they have no idea the constant bills that comes with owning a commercial vehicle.

Good luck.

 

[Builder]

The truck has to be registered for the maximum weight, including trailer, for which it may haul.

When you reg it you will see that it is expensive. You also need a state DOT # for over 10k lbs. They sometimes do not ask you for this when you reg, but the nice DOT Commercial Vehicle Enforcement man will ask you why you don't have one when he does a force roadside inspection and sets it on the scales just before he writes you a ticket.

PA doesn't require a DOT # as long as you stay within the state boundaries. I haven't had one on my IH dump for 5 years- and 15 years of previous big trucks and no issues with the law.

As for a 1 ton rated at 10k, good luck with that. The truck alone must weigh 9k lbs. Doesn't leave much for payload. You get caught over the weight and you're done for.

Mine only weighs 8,000 lbs, but you're right, to tow a trailer, you must register for the truck and trailer combination weight if you plan to tow a trailer.

Also, insurance, call your insurance co. and let them know what your planning, they may have other thoughts, Geico isn't big on insuring commercial trucks.

Owning a commercial vehicle is expensive, I get customers tell me all the time it seems like a lot of money for delivery charges, they have no idea the constant bills that comes with owning a commercial vehicle.

Good luck.

When I got around to registering my vehicles commercially about 15 years ago, I found my rates were essentially the same.

Even now, my '08 Chevy Tahoe costs about $900/yr for coverage and my '07 GMC3500 costs about the same.

I think a lot of the disagreements we see about insurance, registration, inspections, etc that we see are caused by STATES having different laws about vehicles.

Good points you make.