220v outlet for welder powered by (2) 20 amp breakers

[MossRoad]

OK, so reading up on it, it's a multi-wire branch circuit. Circuit as in singular, not circuits, plural. It's one circuit, not two. Correct?

 

[grsthegreat]

OK, so reading up on it, it's a multi-wire branch circuit. Circuit as in singular, not circuits, plural. It's one circuit, not two. Correct?

no, there 2 separate circuits. They share a neutral. The reason you use 2 pole breaker is the necessity to kill both circuits in the box if working on it.

 

[grsthegreat]

Contractors here use them to run both required kitchen circuits for kitchen. Can run both circuits thru 1 wire. Again...not on my jobs

 

[MossRoad]

no, there 2 separate circuits. They share a neutral. The reason you use 2 pole breaker is the necessity to kill both circuits in the box if working on it. View attachment 669015

Yes, I see the same circuit example all over the place. All of them refer to it as a circuit, not circuits. Anyhow, looks nightmarish. Thanks for the info.

 

[grsthegreat]

Yes, I see the same circuit example all over the place. All of them refer to it as a circuit, not circuits. Anyhow, looks nightmarish. Thanks for the info.

you should see how bright incandescent lights ger when you unhook the neutral. Like looking at sun. Led lights get instantly destroyed

 

[k0ua]

To the OP, Well Gene, looks about like I said earlier, the 120 volt works, but not really to your satisfaction. Cant run the sizes of rods you would like at the heat settings you would need without breaker tripping. You really need at least a 240 volt (or what ever it runs in your area) at least 30 amp circuit and breaker, and at a minimum #10 wire, BUT I would go bigger. And here is why, what if some day you want a larger welder? I put in a 50 amp circuit (kinda standard for homeowner welding circuits ) and wire and breaker sized to match. While I have never gotten a larger welder, I can if I want to.

 

[GeneV]

To the OP, Well Gene, looks about like I said earlier, the 120 volt works, but not really to your satisfaction. Cant run the sizes of rods you would like at the heat settings you would need without breaker tripping. You really need at least a 240 volt (or what ever it runs in your area) at least 30 amp circuit and breaker, and at a minimum #10 wire, BUT I would go bigger. And here is why, what if some day you want a larger welder? I put in a 50 amp circuit (kinda standard for homeowner welding circuits ) and wire and breaker sized to match. While I have never gotten a larger welder, I can if I want to.

I hear ya man, but since I'm stumped for now....well look it, I could never get my 90 amp flux core welder to bite into 1/4" plate like I did with this Amico on 120v, using e6011. That's a win right there!

I forgot which one of you guys said it, just learn to weld stick using the power you got. Sounds legit to me, I'll figure something out with the electricity eventually.

 

[GeneV]

OK, I'm confused (nothing new there). You can't put 2 circuits on a 2-pole breaker.

Me personally, the only thing I know about electricity is which wire to use with which breaker, stuff along those lines. I know enough to keep from blowing stuff up lol, but as far as actual electrical theory, I'm fairly ignorant. I only learned about this edison circuit by googling shared neutral wire circuits.

 

[grsthegreat]

Not wanting to reread entire post, but cant you just run a new circuit back to panel thru crawl space or attic. Im an electrical contractor and did that cra* nearly every week. Not that hard, and would of taken less time than rereading 4 pages of replies.

 

[GeneV]

Not wanting to reread entire post, but cant you just run a new circuit back to panel thru crawl space or attic. Im an electrical contractor and did that cra* nearly every week. Not that hard, and would of taken less time than rereading 4 pages of replies.

It's not super easy here, but yeh where there's a will, there's a way. In any case, the original quick & dirty idea is dead in the water, that's obvious now.

 

[MossRoad]

That's what decorative ceiling beams are for...

:laughing:

 

[GeneV]

Tear out the drywall, tell the wife I remodeled the house...we're now open-concept / industrial look. I'm sure she'll grow to love it.

 

[k0ua]

Tear out the drywall, tell the wife I remodeled the house...we're now open-concept / industrial look. I'm sure she'll grow to love it.

I have a lot of experience of fishing wire in existing walls without destroying them. Is there anything I can help with? Also there are a lot of good you tube videos showing some rather tough fishing problems. A lot of it is the right tools, and the rest is experience. I have done literally thousands for over 20 years before I became an engineer I was a tech.

 

[MossRoad]

Tear out the drywall, tell the wife I remodeled the house...we're now open-concept / industrial look. I'm sure she'll grow to love it.

Yep. Spray paint all the studs, wiring, etc, white. Anything over 8' high paint black. It'll look great!

 

[GeneV]

I have a lot of experience of fishing wire in existing walls without destroying them. Is there anything I can help with? Also there are a lot of good you tube videos showing some rather tough fishing problems. A lot of it is the right tools, and the rest is experience. I have done literally thousands for over 20 years before I became an engineer I was a tech.

Yeh, it seems a few of you guys are in the trade. I really appreciate it man, I'll get back to you on that if I decide to go that route.

 

[bcp]

I need a welding bead you apply with a caulking gun, then set it afire, like how rails are welded.

Bruce

 

[k0ua]

I need a welding bead you apply with a caulking gun, then set it afire, like how rails are welded.

Bruce

Well, a MIG nozzle is pretty close to that wish...

 

[MossRoad]

I need a welding bead you apply with a caulking gun, then set it afire, like how rails are welded.

Bruce

Patent that! :thumbsup:

 

[pmsmechanic]

called an edison circuit. Example would be running a 12/3 romex to a single outlet under a kitchen sink for dishwasher and disposal. Instead of running 2 separate 12/2. Personally i hate them, there dangerous (if the neutral gets disconnected you can put 220 thru everything on those circuits). It is legal but both circuits have to be landed on two pole breaker. In commercial 3 phase jobs, lots of people pull 3 hots and 1 neutral in a conduit to make 3 separate 120 volt circuits. Done all the time...but not on my jobs.

I've done this before as I knew it would pass inspection. I never thought of your scenario but I'm with you. I'll never do it again.

This is the beauty of this site. You always learn something, even if it's how not to do things.

 

[GeneV]

I don't much like this edison circuit either, but in my case it's only one isolated outlet at the far end of my garage, sharing the neutral with all the other outlets in the garage on another circuit, so I know what's on and off in there. Plus, I rigged that one outlet with a toggle switch, so could just turn it off.