Grapple Millonzi Grapple

[Glowplug]

I can sense an impending barrage of Westendorf "Brush Crusher" opinions to follow.

For some thoughts on the Westendorf see my thread: "Grapples Galore".

If I had a ton of money I may possibly consider getting one of these. But only after I had a regular brush grapple rake AND a 3-in-1 bucket. It may be good for pulling out fence posts. But for the price, I'd never likely buy one as my primary grapple.

 

[IslandTractor]

I saw a new type of grapple from westendorf. It's a new design and would work best for carrying brush. You couldn't dig with it or pop out any small stumps.

That is an interesting and very weird concept. I imagine that if you were picking up logs it would be excellent as it must weigh close to nothing and the independent grapple arms could certainly hold on to a log. However, despite the photo they show with a regular brush load, I am pretty sure this thing would be lousy at general brush grapple duties. For starters, how would you use it to attack a bush you wanted to rip out? There is nothing to grab on to with in the middle of the grapple. You could not lift rocks or pull up roots easily. I don't know how you'd grab a stump either. Looks to me like a specialty device for someone who is really focused on moving cut logs/trees.

 

[flINTLOCK]

Most interesting discussion in a while. IMHO, I think the Millonzi may be best bang for the buck. Just have to figure out how to rig it when it gets here!! Thanks for the great input and photos.

 

[Johnagain]

Hey guys I just ordered the 48in LD grapple from Millonzi today with JohnDeere mounts for my 4310. Now I'll be able to move all the trees and brush I cut down for others. I also ordered the WR Long diverter kit. Now all I have to do is install it. Now if I could get something other than Dial up I'll be able to post some pictures of all the equipment I have acquired, built, or modified for my business.

 

[IslandTractor]

Let us know how the JD mounts work. Do you have the JD quick attach system or just pins?

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

So Millonzi does offer the ld grapples with the JD quick tach pins rather than the skid steer type. I just sent Joe an email on that very question. Island, I know your really into the 48" LD model but do you really think that the 60" is too much? I believe it's just under 400lbs and that would still leave me with around 1klbs of lifting power. Do you recommend the 48" for it's manuverabity? The weight of the 48" would be only a little more than mu bucket. I'm also going to be getting one of thier (millonzi) thumbs for my BH.
They look pretty rugged and I really like the fact that Joe is a TBNer. To me it seems like he really cares and will stand behind their products.

Matt T.

 

[Johnagain]

I have just the pins style on my loader. I can't see going to the quiktach system when it is just as easy to convert over to the pin style. I'm ordering their brackets separately. I'm going to weld them on myself. I want to make some measurements of them and might incorperate the style into other things I make for the FEL. They have been great people to work with and I would buy from them again.

 

[IslandTractor]

I know your really into the 48" LD model but do you really think that the 60" is too much? I believe it's just under 400lbs and that would still leave me with around 1klbs of lifting power.

No, I don't think that 60" would be too much. Maybe I have overstated the case in the past but my main points are that 1) the 48" can deal with virtually anything a loader with less than 3000lbs of lift can deal with. And 2) that most of the larger grapples or HD grapples weigh >600 or 700lbs which really puts a dent in most CUT FEL lift capacity. That is not the case with the LD60" you are referring to which weighs 400lbs.

I have found myself wishing I had more lift capacity, more curl capacity and more weight on the rear of the tractor (already have loaded tires and bush hog) but I have virtually never wished I'd had a wider grapple. My ranting about getting grapples that are too large is partly to overcome the understandable bias that prospective grapple owners have in selecting a model that is the same length as their bucket. It is not a one to one translation and in general smaller is better. The other point is that the bigger grapples tend to be half inch or even 3/4 or 1" steel tines which adds a huge amount of weight and cost for no reason unless you are doing construction demolition.

 

[GreatWhitehunter]

Island, my concern with the 48" LD is that it doesn't clear the tires. If I'm heading in to a large brush pile or in the woods. I think it would be good to have a grapple wide enough to protect the front end. Since I have no experiance with a grapple I maybe way off base. I can also see your point with the 48" since you can get some pretty large stuff in it. For me I bet price will be the determining factor. What did shipping run you? Has anyone picked up thier grapples in ohio? I'll bo ordering a thumb too so it maybe worth the trip for me as I'm sure shipping is going to be high.

Matt T.

 

[Johnagain]

Shipping for the grapple and the plates is $135 to Cental Florida. I don't think that was to bad. I Certainly couldn't go get it for that price. and it is still cheaper than most of the other grapples out there.

 

[IslandTractor]

Island, my concern with the 48" LD is that it doesn't clear the tires. If I'm heading in to a large brush pile or in the woods. I think it would be good to have a grapple wide enough to protect the front end.

That is an interesting question. I find that when I advance into a brush pile that I fill up the grapple well before my front wheels come in contact with the pile. When I am in living brush I am generally not charging in but rather selecting which bush or batch of bramble I will attack next and move directly to that object with the grapple centered. The times when I get all tangled in brush are when I get too aggressive about moving forwards and don't properly clear my flanks. Then I have briar, trees, bushes whatever all around me and in that circumstance my front wheels are the least of my concerns. The appropriate way to prevent brush from harming your tractor is not to be too aggressive and to clear an area wide enough for the tractor to easily turn around in by moving and clearing laterally, not just forwards.

Even ignoring the 200-400+lb weight penalty of the bigger grapples, I think having a grapple as large as 72" would for brush work be more of a disadvantage than advantage. Manuverability would be compromised and you could not selectively put all the FEL power into a central spot as easily as with a smaller grapple. Think about having a backhoe bucket that is 6ft wide. Unless you are strip mining even the biggest excavators don't have buckets that big. Not because they don't have the power but because the optimal size is smaller. I think that is also true for grapples, at least when used fo general landscaping purposes. In my experience, grapples are different than mowers, rakes, box blades etc where one generally gets the largest size their tractor can handle. With the grapple it is more like choosing a backhoe bucket. You focus on what you are trying to get done and choose the correct size. You don't need T1 steel tines 3/4" thick for brush. If you are doing construction debris removal then you want a very heavy duty T1 steel wide bucket and an appropriately sized skid steer to manage it. When using a CUT for general landscape work, brush removal, picking up the occasional big rock, lifting or dragging cut trees, ripping out brush and saplings, etc, the width of the grapple is not the limiting factor in what you can get done. I don't have experience on 50hp tractors with loaders capable of lifting >2500lbs or with breakout power in the 4000lb range. I'd still imagine that even with that power you'd like to be able to concentrate the force on the specific bush, rock, tree, whatever of interest though and therefore a grapple narrower than the standard bucket would be more useful. If you look at purpose built stump grapples you can see that they are much narrower than regular root or general purpose grapples for just that reason. I certainly understand that 48" is not necessarily optimal for every size tractor and I would guess that a 60" grapple would start to make sense with >2000lbs lift capacity at pivot pins or approximately a 40-45hp CUT. I honestly don't see any use of >60" grapples for general purpose work even for big CUTs or smaller utility tractors like the Kubota M series.

Size ain't everything and bigger is not always better .

 

[Dougster]

Island, my concern with the 48" LD is that it doesn't clear the tires. If I'm heading in to a large brush pile or in the woods. I think it would be good to have a grapple wide enough to protect the front end.

Size ain't everything and bigger is not always better

Just to throw in my (unnecessary) two cents: There is no question that "IT" is the undisputed "Guru of Grapples"... and he did successfully influence me to give up on my "full-size" 72 inch "same-as-bucket" grapple aspirations (or wider?) and settle for something less wide. This turned out very well because the less wide (66") grapple I settled on enabled me to buy heavier-duty yet still stay within my maximum grapple weight and corresponding minimum lifting weight goals. Success!!!

That being said, I too refused to seriously consider anything smaller than roughly 60 inches wide even if it meant less heavy-duty... roughly the same dimension as my front tire track width (62-64 inches +/-). Protection of those front tires was important to me as it was clear that the previous owner of my tractor had experienced some nasty tire damage in his brief ownership and relatively "safe" uses. Further, my use is expected to be quite varied... far beyond brush and occasional rock removal... and twin grapples was a non-negotiable requirement for safely carrying certain construction materials.

Interestingly, in the end, protecting those front tires became somewhat of a secondary factor to the issue of maximizing bulk carrying capacity while not limiting mobility... i.e., those spaces into which the tractor could go. Working around and between many trees and structures that I don't wish to damage, approximately matching the front tire width simply made the most sense. It was the best overall compromise.

Admittedly, with a brush-only agenda, I could have gone even narrower, lighter and single arm... and the ultimate would still be to have two grapples: one for everyday light-duty applications and one for serious root/rock/construction/demolition work. I still may end up going that route if the right deal suddenly comes along.

Dougster

 

[IslandTractor]

... and the ultimate would still be to have two grapples

Oh yeah. Now you're talking. People have two mowers (bush hog and finish) so why not? I'll have to decide whether my next one will be the WR Long style with full length top grapple (optimized for brush pile removal) or a narrow stump grapple to make faster work of those pesky things.

I understand the concern about front tires and have to admit that my 48" grapple does cover the footprint of my tractor. However I would reiterate that you are not moving at great speed when grappling brush and you can see what is coming pretty clearly. Also, I find I am more often using the grapple in a raised position rather than on the ground so even if it were wider it would not necessarily "protect" the front tires from running into a stump or rock.

As an aside, an issue with any grapple is that when you have a grapple fully loaded and raise it to a comfortable transport position (a foot or two off the ground), the load really does block your view forward. That happens even with a narrow grapple obviously. Being able to peek around the side as you move forward is helpful. Sometimes I need to stop, raise the grapple to full height to see under it, then lower and move forward again. Though really an issue with any size grapple as stuff generally sticks out the side (see photo), it might be a bit worse with a wider one.

 

[LaVita]

Oh what a great thread. I definitely want a grapple. Where can I get the Millonzi? I did the usual web search and didn't come up with anything.

Thanks,
Chuck

 

[mscheer772]

joemillonzi@miprocts.com

 

[mscheer772]

oops joemillonzi@miproductsgroup.com

 

[pekabu]

I have been emailing some else in the org about a Quick Attach for my TC24d. They have a blank and weld up the appropriate fittings for your loader. I have to go out and do some measuring for the fitting and price.

 

[RollTideRam]

oops joemillonzi@miproductsgroup.com

If your email works as bad as mine, you can pm joe@mi
He is now a TBN member. JC

 

[LaVita]

Just an fyi. I contacted Millonzi about their size recommendatiaon for my tractor. I have a Kubota L4330 with a LA853 loader and they recommended the 66" or 72" root grapple. The price was in the $1600 range plus shipping.

Chuck

 

[IslandTractor]

I have a Kubota L4330 with a LA853 loader and they recommended the 66" or 72" root grapple.

As argued earlier in this thread, I think you'll find the smaller size more appropriate for a CUT, especially if you are doing brush removal and general landscape work. Millonzi has two lines of grapples, a light duty line that is meant for CUTs and small skid steers and a heavier line that is intended for big skid steers. My advice, even with a hefty CUT like the L4330 would be to stay with the light duty line as you'll save both $$$ and lift capacity. The heavier grapples are aimed more at full time construction debris removal etc and it is unlikely someone with a CUT in home or farm service is going to put that kind of stress on the grapple. The "light duty" grapples are not toys and can handle virtually any brush/tree/root work with no sweat.

Also, narrow is good as it makes manuvering easier and allows you to focus the lift capacity.