problems removing snap ring / circlip / retaining ring

[boggen]

allis chalmers 1954 CA tractor. a bearing went out going out to pulley that drives belly mower. end result = chewed up gears and lots of metal shavings.

i need to remove PTO shaft #5 from gear #37, main issue is #7 snap ring. ((see below link)) once i get these out of the way. i can get to belt pulley shaft, and tear it apart, find what all needs to be replaced.

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DRIVE TRAIN - POWER TAKE OFF
#7 snap ring / retaining ring / circlip

it is an internal snap ring. (no holes for regular snap ring pliers *big frown*) one end = a 45 degree notch. i have not figured out anything that i can use to get in behind of the little edge. and pry out the snap ring from the grove. i have searched internet everything is for "with holes" not without holes. and if without holes, it = only installing not removing them *arghs*

i have used various screw drivers, metal filler end, that i grinded down with a little notching. but so far all the metal i have on hand. bends before i can barely get the snap ring to budge. (not enough to get anything behind it. to pry it out).

i am a bit un-easy drilling a "hole" into the main casting / pto body. near the snap so as to create a spot to pry the snap ring out. the snap ring holds the bearing in place. and any place i might get a drill bit into. is rather very ugly spot to drill into. and would be afraid of weakening things. to point of hooking up say a rotatory cutter or post hold digger, or other equipment. and run pto internal shaft right into the transmission.

i see comments in internet searching as a "one use only snap ring" assuming folks giving up and just grinding as much as possible of the snap ring out with a dremal. and buying a replacement snap ring.

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going to need to find a "slide hammer" or something. to nock #5 PTO shaft. out of gear #37 (to get past the key in the PTO shaft). i had to replace the PTO shaft a few years back. due to cracking in half. and i had to use some rather hefty hits of a regular sledge hammer to nock everything together.

wonder if i can lift tractor up. and let it back down. onto pto shaft maybe. with extra bracing to push the shaft out *meh* sounds like i will be loosing a finger / hand. awell.

 

[MossRoad]

I've had good "last chance" results with tools like these picks from harbor freight. If you break them, hey, they were two bucks!

4 Piece Pick and Hook Set

 

[Eric C]

I had a snap ring like that with no holes and 45 deg cut a few weeks ago. It was in a spot very difficult to reach. I was able to use these pliers to get the clip open enough to use a long skinny small flat screwdriver to pop it off.

Snap Ring Pliers with Interchangeable Heads

It did take several tries and some bad language, but I finally got it off. After you play with the pliers a bit, you will get the hang of opening the clip, trick for me was getting in the screwdriver in without letting it pop back in place. Maybe somebody will have a better plan.

 

[Leejohn]

This is the tool to remove it.

 

[jaotguy]

get a small tipped nail punch ( for driving finishing nails deeper) and a small set of "precision screw drivers" from the dollar store ..... grind 2 sides till it fits in the c clip groove , then grind the punch at a 45 degree angle across the tip ... now a very small sharp chisel ... set the sharp tip into the groove and the bevel side to the c clip and tap up against the C clip till it starts to pry it out of the groove ... slip a small flat screw driver between the c clip and the groove when you get enough free...

 

[boggen]

done ask'ed family. and mom showed up and dropped off below tonight. no clue were she found it locally. but looks like it might be the ticket! nice curve to it for prying like a regular claw hammer and looks to be correct thickness from initial glance. will try over weekend. *crossing fingers*
Amazon.com: Wilmar W1219 Seal Puller: Automotive

if above fails. i may end up going with your suggestion mossroad / jaotguy. and get a pick set. hopefully a harden set, that will not bend, vs other metal stuff i have tried so far.

 

[MossRoad]

Here's some screen shots of the snap ring... hope that helps with suggestions. Part #7 is what the O.P. is looking to remove.

 

[MossRoad]

It looks like you'd have to remove all that other stuff before it to get to that snap ring to open it to get it off the shaft?

 

[Leejohn]

Boys that tool I posted it works eather flat when you have all kinds of room or up and down when there is no room. I don't think that seal puller is going to get it. Hope it does.

 

[boggen]

leejohn
a pair of angled needle nose pliers, no go. there is nothing to pry on per say.

mossroad.
shim between bearing cup and snap ring. covers end of PTO shaft, just enough. to make hammering the shaft out rather difficult.

large exploded diagram. once you click image you may need to click it once or twice to see large picture.

 

[joecdeere]

LeeJohn nailed it, I have several Allis tractors and that pair of pliers and a thin screwdriver will take them out with some work.

 

[Baby Grand]

boggen - the tool that leejohn shows is what I have and exactly what you need.
The jaws open when you squeeze the handles to expand the ring.

In some cases, the trick is that you don't want to remove that snap ring - you just need to expand it enough to get it out of the groove in the shaft.
Then you should be able to slide the rear cover off, over the end of the shaft, or slide the shaft out from under the snap ring.

I had to do a similar job to take a manual gearbox apart on an old Volvo - that's when I bought those pliers.
Took me awhile to figure out that the dang ring wasn't coming off without something getting broken, but if I could get it out of the slot, all the gears & the shaft would come sliding off under their own weight (like a freight train that's run out of track & onto the concrete floor)!

You should be able to get those pliers at NAPA or similar - worth a try?

 

[Leejohn]

Did you get it out?

 

[bcp]

What some people are missing is that this is an INTERNAL snap ring. It won't come out by expanding it.

Using the OP's diagram in post 10, I added some arrows and text showing how I have removed this type of ring.

Bruce

 

[boggen]

never did get the snap ring out. i got to budge with the one tool were i could almost get something in behind it. then i fudged the one good pry end of the snap ring i need to get the snap ring out.

here in a bit will be ordering entire piece (pto casing), pto rod, 2 gears, and a drive shaft out to the pulley for the belly mower. i saw 3 last week, 2 on ebay, and 1 i think i craiglist. will just order entire thing. and be done with it. tired of fighting it. will work on it this winter. after i get other entire rear end, on tractor and grass mowed. grass is getting about knee high now.

and to note it, the one tool almost got me to your image BCP, but just would not give it up, so close, so so close, and then fudge the pry snap ring were i could pry.

 

[Leejohn]

I see you are near Peoria. Boy if I was still in Rockton I would of come down and see if I could of helped. Sure would of love to give that a shot.

 

[DLTTrekkers]

Have you tri and push on one end to push it off from the shaft ? like in a sircular motion ?

 

[City Farmer]

Don't waste your time with pliers or punches, you'll lose your mind. Go to HF and buy a small 1/8" pencil grinder with a tiny cut off wheel. Cut through most of the way and fold it in half.

 

[skyhook]

LeeJohn nailed it, I have several Allis tractors and that pair of pliers and a thin screwdriver will take them out with some work.

I think this is the best idea so far, you need to pry it out from the inside and up,, with a small screwdriver...
then the rest should follow if you add another small screwdriver at the top working your way around until it snaps out.

 

[LD1]

For those snap rings I use a flathead screwdriver specially ground. And it needs to be a larger, and higher quality screwdriver. Guys that work on automatic transmissions know all about them snaprings.

The screwdriver will look like this