Refueling effort

   / Refueling effort #71  
patrick_g said:
Actually it seemed like a no brainer to me... steel, air tight, free...

And then there was a wave of elevated concern about all those concentrated vapors, explosions from plugging it in, warts, tight shoes, delayed borgrythmia(sp) I almost lost it but with a couple PM's offering counseling and support I was able to recover and press on.

Pat
Somehow I've always felt that If I had my druthers I'd druther loose a refrigerator than my house garage or pole building.
Could it be I've been wrong all these long 41 years and should have been risking my house garage or pole building instead of a lowly old junk refrigerator?
== L B ==.
 
   / Refueling effort #72  
Wow are we getting lazy or what ??:confused:

Remember when you had no tractor, just a wheel barrow and a shovel:eek:
 
   / Refueling effort #74  
Hey, LB, maybe we should seek professional help or at least voluntarily enroll in a 12 step program (maybe I could start with just a 6 step program and work up towards 12, I have trouble remembering complicated stuff) until we come to our senses. More's the pity that we didn't realize the error of our ways when using a cheap/free air tight steel box located away from our residence or other expensive structure out of a misguided desire to improve our fire safety/risk profile.

Now, after receiving some enlightenment through beneficial exposure to fire code suggestions such as building a storage box for flammable materials out of plywood instead of using a free airtight steel box, I feel much better or will when SOMEONE TELLS ME what kind of plywood does not delaminate in a fire.

But seriously... I really would like to know what plywood was intended for use in flammable storage structures as I might want to build something like that some time or to be able to knowledgeably pass the info on to others. Old freezers and friges are not always the best/only answer.

Pat
 
   / Refueling effort #75  
keving said:
That is beautiful. Can you provide an approx cost, source and capacity?

Thanks!

The cost of my setup was about $1000. I know it will never pay for itself but I like the convenience. The tank holds 300 gallons. I replaced a gravity feed tank this year that I had for 30 years. I wanted the pump because I plan on eventually having all diesel cars. Then I'll fill it with taxable fuel. The pump also allows me to use a 2 micron filter which would run pretty slow on a gravity feed system.

The tank is single wall with a pan under it. I got it from our local Farm Service guy. They fill it as well.
 
   / Refueling effort #76  
Patrick, I cannot tell you exactly which plywood they use, but I can tell you that it just appears as extra thick, very fine grade multiply wood.

Doubt that really helps much, and it also has the specs for steel in there as well, and certainly there are many more steel flam lockers out there then there are the wooden ones.

That said, some of the corrosive lockers that we buy are wood, as in some of those instances, the wood tends to hold up better and have less potential other hazards associated with it.

As another side note, flam lockers also are often vented, and I do not believe I have ever seen one that was "airtight" Most flam lockers I am familiar with have vent plugs (usually a weld in 2" bung) with at least one high, and one low to allow cross ventilation of the flam locker.

I would have to go back into the regs to find the citation, but I believe that one part of the thinking on the flam locker was also to keep the fire away from the flammables as in the temp inside a bit cooler and flames away, so that they would not ignite. Kind of like a two hour fire door.

Not sure if that makes sense or not and the way I am explaining it, but if you will, it gives the fire department a bit of time before the "fuel" gets added to the fire.

That said, the most straight forward thing I think folks should do is to identify where their problems are, and then post an NFPA 704 (that square on point red, white, blue and yellow thing you see on warehouses and such) with appropriate numbers on a hazard area. While it does not tell them exactly what they are facing, it gives them a heads up of the danger level that they should expect.
 
   / Refueling effort #77  
Alan,

NFPA 30 does not require the storage cabinet to be vented. My experience is most are not. However, if they are vented they must be steel pipe to the outside of the building. When I look at flammable cabinets I check that the bungs are tight in place and if not they are vented properly.

Check out this fire adjacent to a cabinet which started in a refrigerator with flammable liquids.

Google Image Result for http://www2.umdnj.edu/eohssweb/aiha/images/fire.h1.jpg

This one is even better a fire starting in a room with a cabinet, outside of the cabinet has fire damage, inside the cabinet is fine.

Google Image Result for http://ehs.ucsc.edu/emergency/images/cabinet.JPG
 
   / Refueling effort #78  
patrick_g said:
Hey, LB, maybe we should seek professional help
Pat

Great idea!! We can set up a LB/PG help fund and I'll be treasurer! :D Here's the first contribution - sorry it's only 2 cents.
 
   / Refueling effort #79  
NY_Yankees_Fan said:
Allen,

NFPA 30 does not require the storage cabinet to be vented. My experience is most are not. However, if they are vented they must be steel pipe to the outside of the building. When I look at flammable cabinets I check that the bungs are tight in place and if not they are vented properly.

Any of you actual certified fire protection experts want to make a comment regarding a freezer or refrigerator used as a flammable liquids storage locker when it is placed outside away from buildings and combustible materials?

Is it a good idea, bad idea, unknown, worse than x but better than y (commonly understood substitutions for x and y please) as that would be useful information.

I''m not a member of a religious cult based on recycling household appliances. I just though metal, air tight(mostly), and cheap or free was a good candidate for flammables storage lockers. If they are a bomb waiting for a chance to go off or if they have other dangerous attributes, I'd be happy to build a storage cabinet or ventilate the frige or...

There are cheap little solar powered fans designed to cool a car parked in the sun which could be adapted to ventilate a reefer when the sun shines (when it might need venting the most.)

I guess I'm looking for a definitive statement appraising the use of a recycled appliance for flammable storage so I can make an informed decision to keep or replace it.

Thanks for sharing your specialized knowledge.

Pat
 
   / Refueling effort #80  
davitk said:
Great idea!! We can set up a LB/PG help fund and I'll be treasurer! :D Here's the first contribution - sorry it's only 2 cents.

Cash, check, money order accepted. Cash or reasonable facsimile preferred (not so reasonable facsimiles will be referred to the Treasury Department. Give big give often, the need is great!

Pat
 

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