ROPS Options?

Harv · Sep 2, 2000

Stopped by the closest thing to a Kubota dealer in my area today to check out the economy L's. Mind you, this is near where I live, not where my big property is, and it's not tractor country around here. The only Economy L he had in stock was still in its crate, so I didn't get a look. I didn't know they came in crates. /w3tcompact/icons/crazy.gif

Anyway, I got to chatting with the general manager of the place and told him of my on-going quest for a reasonably priced L, even it means buying used. One of the specific questions I asked him was about the ROPS. One of my criteria is that I have to lock up the tractor in my shop, which means driving it through a standard garage door. This will obviously mean that the ROPS has to be the kind that either comes apart or folds down.

Some of the older tractors I have looked at have a single-piece ROPS, which up to now I assumed could be dealt with by either swapping in a newer one or modifying the old one. This guy told me that each ROPS is made for a specific tractor (meaning size and weight of tractor), and that each tractor comes with one kind or the other -- no options.

I'm having a hard time swallowing this as fact, but he is a dealer and dealers are always right, aren't they? /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif When I got home I thumbed through my brochures to see if I could find two pictures of the same model with different ROPS options. Inconclusive. Anybody out there know the truth?

And finally, if I find a good deal on a tractor with a single-piece ROPS, couldn't a competent shop modify it so the top section can be removed? This ain't rocket science here, but then I don't know my tractor science, either.

scruffy · Sep 2, 2000

Harv, simple question. Which is cheaper, modifying your shop door, or possibly loss of life? ROP's warrenties (from my research) are void if modified in any manner, ie drilling holes into, welding on, cutting, etc. The structural integrity of the ROP's is modified when any of the above are done to it. Thus the greater potential in a catastrophic (to you and yours) accident. Your choice.

Harv · Sep 2, 2000

Aha!

In re-reading the brocuhre for the Grand L's I see that the Foldable ROPS is clearly listed as an "option". From the pictures it looks like the non-option version is a one-piece unit, not the take-apart kind.

Scruffy makes a good point -- I'm not looking to risk my life on a Rube Goldberg ROPS hack, and I hadn't even considered warranty issues. I sort of assumed if I get an older tractor there would be no warranty left, but who knows?

I am fortunate in that I have several friends who are high-priced engineers and at least one who specializes in metal fabrication issues, so I would definitely consult them about any "hack" I might be contemplating. I am still hoping that for 500 bucks or so I could simply have a new ROPS installed.

As for modifying the garage door, I've already looked into that and unfortunately on this particular door the header cannot be raised without altering the roof line itself. It would almost make more sense to lower the floor -- have it ramp up into the shop. Not a very attractive solution either.

scruffy · Sep 2, 2000

Harv, I hope you come up with an amiciable solution. I need to put a ROP's on my ol' L175 or L1500 Grey if you will. I am not using it much yet, as I need to complete a few repairs. When I get topside, it will get a new steering wheel, seat with seat belt, ROP's with canopy of some sort, and light treatment. I know its an old antique, but I enjoy playing with it.
Sorry if I sounded a little harsh, but I wouldn't want to see anyone get hurt. I'd rather see you modify that garage door! Where there is a will, there is a way.

EddieW · Sep 2, 2000

Harv, when I was looking in March every tractor I looked at had the foldable ROPS available for around $150. I have seen retrofit ROPS available but I'm not sure they are made for all tractors, possibly just the more common ones. I got the foldable ROPS because I have standard garage doors then put canopy on top which makes it a little more difficult to fold down. THe canopy is worth 10 times what I paid for it right now with the heat.

gerard · Sep 2, 2000

Harv,
What the dealer told you was accurate according to what I went through when buying my L2500DT. I wanted the foldable rops but that was only an option on the Grande L series. I have a fixed ROPS but it is not a single piece. The top CAN be removed by taking out two bolts on each side and then pulling off the top. Doable, just not convenient. I havene't done anything with it because I have an oversized garage door and can pull in as is. It would be a simple tast to weld a hinge on an turn it into a foldable ROPS but I haven't the need. If I did I wouldn't hesitate or worry about the warranty issue. These things are so heavy duty that I can't see just rolling them over causing any fear of collapsing the steel. The only thing you might have a problem with is the muffler, which is a vertical stack andis about 1/2 inch too high to get into my regular garage. (However this is so close you could cut off the 1/2 inch and not miss it)

Muhammad · Sep 2, 2000

If the tractor you decide to buy doesn't fit your opening...

As others mentioned, modifying the ROPS at all will likely weaken it... and you don't want to find out how much the modification weakens it first hand. I'd leave the ROPS as it came if non-foldable, or replace with an OEM foldable unit if available, just to be safe.

Since the newer grand-L models have the optional foldable ROPS, you could probably add a foldable ROPS to a used grand-L machine, which might be in your price range... if you can find one. Since the design hasn't been changed much since it was introduced (minor updates and model # changes in '99), the folding ROPS from a new model would likely fit. But you'd be looking at several hundred $$ for a new ROPS, and the one you remove probably won't be worth a whole lot, and certainly not as much as you'd have to pay for the new, foldable unit.

Or, you could always let some air out of the tires when you drive the tractor in to make it fit!

<font color=blue>...dealers are always right, aren't they? /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif</font color=blue>

On this issue, pretty much. On others, I'm not so sure. I've heard some dealers say some crazy things... /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Harv · Sep 2, 2000

Great information and advice coming in -- gotta love this message board. Still hoping to hear from somebody with first-hand experience.

So far it sounds like my most desirable option would be to find an OEM replacement unit, if available. I realize there would be some bucks involved here

, but I can't think of a more important part to spend the money on.

Second choice is shaping up to be the garage door modification. I'm still scratching my head, but the only solutions I see there would be a pretty major (and expensive) undertaking.

Hacking the ROPS to be what I want has dropped to third place since, as Muhammad pointed out, I don't want the final test to be for me to be upside down with a couple tons of tractor strapped to my butt. /w3tcompact/icons/shocked.gif

That final option -- letting the air out of the tires every time I want to drive through the door -- Dude, are you serious? (Actually, the thought already occurred to me, but I would like to be fairly spontaneous about taking the tractor out for a quick chore, plus I can't imagine this scenario would do much for the life expectancy of the tires.)

gerard · Sep 2, 2000

Harv,
If you get the chance for an economy model with the pull apart ROPS I wouldn't pass on it just because of the ROPS issue. Maybe I wasn't clear and I wouldn't advise taking a single piece ROPS, cutting it apart and then welding a hinge joint. On the pull apart type there is already a full cut on both sides and the ROPS is held together by an internal steel plate and two bolts. Adding a hinge would only strengthen the joint and just make constant removal/installation a simpler process than unbolting and removing the top portion.

Muhammad · Sep 2, 2000

<font color=blue>Dude, are you serious?</font color=blue>

Hey, it's the cheapest solution! /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif But probably not ideal for frequent use.

Depending on which model you wind up with, and what the height of your opening is, you might be able to get away with removing trim only. Or you could look into breaking off a 3-5' section of the concrete, and make a ramp if a modification on the top isn't possible. Although, then you are getting into semi-major demolition/modification either way.

Then there’s the option of building another structure… ---never mind. /w3tcompact/icons/crazy.gif

gerard · Sep 2, 2000

If my memory serves me (debatable!) /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif the height at the tops of the ROPS with R1 tires is around 80" How far off would you be?

Von · Sep 2, 2000

I know this is a no-no but my friend had a Ford 1510 and the ROPS was about 2" too tall. His was a two piece one where the top bar was bolted to the two uprights with two bolts on both sides. so we cut off the top few inches and used the bottom hole as the top hole and drilled out new holes for the bottom bolt. I don't think a sawsall and drill will heat the steel and cause structural damage to the uprights. It gave him the room that he needed to get into the garage. If the tractor you get has this type of ROPS this might be an option if you only need a few inches to make it in.

Bird · Sep 2, 2000

Uh-oh, Von. You may catch the dickens for damaging that ROPS./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif Of course, I agree with everyone else that you don't want to weaken the ROPS (and learn that you did the hard way), and naturally the manufacturers have to include the comment about voiding the warranty for product liability reasons in this day and age. HOWEVER, it's not rocket science; it's just a steel roll bar designed for a particular load or stress. So, if I needed to make mine shorter, I'd do just what you did, and if I needed to make it foldable, I'd cut it and build appropriate hinges and take bets that it'd be just as strong as ever. But for the same reasons the manufacturer tells you not to do it, I'd also tell everyone else not to do it because I don't know exactly how they would do it or how strong it would be afterwards./w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

Bird

gordon · Sep 2, 2000

Re: ROPS Options?safty link!

Here is a good link not only to rops safty but tractor and farm safty allaround---http://www.cdc.gov/niosh/nasd/menus/toptrac.html
Its a good idea to go to their home page and bookmark it for future reference!!!/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
Gordon

Von · Sep 2, 2000

Bird, I'm the same way, but did see no harm in cutting 3" off the ends and moving the holes so it would work. since we cut off the top holes I don't feel we weakened it by drilling new ones for the bolts. Plus it cut and drilled like any other thick walled mild steel. I don't think it was anything special.

Von

Harv · Sep 2, 2000

Re: ROPS Options?safty link!

Wow, Gordon! That's some sobering stuff! /w3tcompact/icons/shocked.gif

I sincerely hope I wind up with a factory-made ROPS. Now that we've talked it to death, I'll probaly luck out and get a foldable ROPS. If money were no object there would be no question about it.

Gerard - The economy L's are spec'd to be 83.1 inches to the top of the ROPS, other L's an inch to an inch and a half more. My door is just barely 80 inches, so yes, we're only talking about a few inches.

Intuitively, I agree with Bird and Von that sawing off a few inches and drilling new bolt holes would not degrade the integrity of the structure -- might even be stronger.

The idea of lowering the floor may not be as bad as it seemed. The shop floor is a slab and then it's right into the dirt. For those who like snapshots, take a peek at
http://www.acknowledge.com/tractor/ShopDoor.html

After lowering the approach (easy if I had a tractor), I would then only have to cut back into the slab a short distance and then maybe pour a simple "step" for the tractor. It would take a concrete saw and a lot of elbow grease, but the total cost shouldn't be bad:

Thanks for all you input, everybody! I feel better knowing there are options.

scruffy · Sep 2, 2000

Re: ROPS Options?safty link!

Harv, the pics of your shop door explain alot! To me, your shop is perfectly situated (from what is visible) and begs for a an extension!! Add end doors on a 25 foot extension and you can have plenty of room to manuver in and out with a lots of shop space to grow into! If that was mine, I would be 'collecting' materials for such an exspansion! Of course, I would have to convince the better half first though. As it is, mine sits outside under a tarp.

Muhammad · Sep 2, 2000

Re: ROPS Options?safty link!

Nice drawing there, Harv! if you decide to do the concrete cutting, you could probably get by with only cutting enough room for 'tracks' for the tractor's tires... which would save some time/work.

Harv · Sep 2, 2000

Re: ROPS Options?safty link!

Scruffy -

Hmmmm... Let's see -- I'm scrounging around trying to find the lowest price I can on maybe a used tractor, and you see this as a good time to throw a 25-ft addition onto my shop? /w3tcompact/icons/tongue.gif

I get it! You're offering to finance the project!!!

The fact is, this is a magnificent wood shop -- a legacy from my father -- and it's already a bit of sacrilege to park a big o'l farm machine with dirty feet in there. It's actually a stop-gap measure (I'm 12 years into my last stop-gap measure) until I can arrange more suitable housing for the little fella.

There is also a similarly-built garden "shed" on the property which might just hold a tractor. It currently has only people doors, so I would have to replace one wall with a garage-type door (a tall garage door, thank you) when/if that looks feasible.

Then there's all them implements -- where are they going to live? There's a lot more to buying a tractor than just buying a tractor, eh?