tractor won't start... help me troubleshoot it.

[Spanner]

I am guessing here that -ve equals negative vehicle earth, or what we would call negative ground? You Kiwi's and Aussies always have interesting names for things. :thumbsup:

Yes,

-ve = Negative and +ve means Positive to us.

It follows the symbols moulded into the top of the battery ( - & + )

You have to remain aware that some very old vehicles/machines are +ve Earth sytems so referencing the polarity of the cable has more clarity than just saying the Ground/Earth.

You guys say "Ground" we say "Earth". Hood/Bonnet. Fender/Mudguard etc. I try to write Americanese when I can. (But I like our British heritage).

For "Coyote" I was just saying, if you disconnect the Earth cable no sparks can occur. If he slips with the knife he could cut a finger, drop the knife, short the +ve battery cable he's cutting into. No issue if the Earth is disconnected.

Regards,
:wrench:

 

[Egon]

Mike, using booster cables go directly from your truck battery to the starter. Ground can be anywhere on the tractor frame. Tap the positive on the red starter lead. The starter should click or make an attemp to turn over. If the starter turns the engine may start with the key in the on position. If so let it warm up and then shut it down and try a normal start. If starter does not turn get a rag, bright flashlight, electrical cleaner and crawl around underneath checking all the wires and connectors. Clean the connectors and oil up all the switch activators. Do the same for the fuzes and relays. ( this could be considered yearly maintenance ) your inspection may turn up something. If that does not work it's time for the meter and procedures of which I'm not familiar with.

Under normal conditions can you hear the fuel solenoid click on turning the key? If it does not click one of the safety/position switches may be the problem?

 

[Spanner]

Be very careful about giving out this kind of advice:

Mike, using booster cables go directly from your truck battery to the starter. Ground can be anywhere on the tractor frame. Tap the positive on the red starter lead. The starter should click or make an attemp to turn over. If the starter turns the engine may start with the key in the on position. If so let it warm up and then shut it down and try a normal start. If starter does not turn get a rag, bright flashlight, electrical cleaner and crawl around underneath checking all the wires and connectors. Clean the connectors and oil up all the switch activators. Do the same for the fuzes and relays. ( this could be considered yearly maintenance ) your inspection may turn up something. If that does not work it's time for the meter and procedures of which I'm not familiar with.

Under normal conditions can you hear the fuel solenoid click on turning the key? If it does not click one of the safety/position switches may be the problem?

... especially in the litigious climate of the USA. If the engine did start-up and the tractor happened to move forward it could trap the unwary and cause some injury (or worse).
Always ensure there is someone (preferably you) in the drivers seat when attempting to start a tractor by any means. One foot on the clutch, park brake engaged etc.

Booster (Jumper) Cables are for jumping battery-to-battery. Not for by-passing all safety interlock circuitry imo.

Safety first, and second.

Regards,
:wrench:

 

[Egon]

Well; call it a sound meter instead of a VOM meter

 

[MikeS_in_GA]

So many helpful tips... so little time!

Battery was 6 months past its warranty. It failed with flying colors. I've had to replace the battery every 2 years since I bought the tractor. Tractor supply Co is about the only option for batteries around here that I have found. Anyhow...

So a new battery was installed. The tractor has 990 hours on it. It is a 1996 model. I pulled the starter as that is right there on the side and super easy to do. I took automotive classes in high school, but I could never take the electrical classes due to scheduling conflicts. So I am way more comfortable with a wrench than I am a VOM.

As someone else pointed out, I don't have a no start problem, I have a no crank problem. There is no 'click' of the starter when I turn the key. The lights do not dim - but they are LED and draw very little power. I had a distant relative die from using the screwdriver trick on the starter to fire up an old tractor. I've never done it, nor have I ever seen it done.

I have moved the range shifter multiple times and the pto lever as well. No change. It does act as though it is in gear or with the PTO on. I haven't been able to get to the switches pertaining to those yet.

I found a wire under the hood that was chewed off - that was going to a factory headlight, and another going to one of the old rear lights. There was a big rat under the hood one day, and the dog made quick work of it. I'm also considering that there may be more damage to the wires that I haven't found.

I was out again this week to look at it, but with the kids along and wanting to fish at the other end of the property, my tractor work time was approximately 3 minutes. lol

The VOM gave a reading of ~13v from the new battery, so it didn't drain in the past few days. The started still won't click.

I unhooked the bush hog, jacked up the loader, and pulled it out of the shed and into the open. I'm very close to calling the dealer and having them come get it, so I got the tractor ready for that if I choose to go that route. Every week that I am playing mechanic, is another week behind I am getting out there. I just have a feeling that a real mechanic would diagnose and fix this in very short order. At some point I have to factor in the time vs convenience vs educating myself on my tractor. On the flip side... now I have more room to work on it

Thanks for all of your help on this!!!

 

[areid]

One last thing I can think of. When my B3030 was delivered I noticed that there was a fuse in the bag with the manual. I was told this is the main fuel fuse, not sure but it could be your issue. Perhaps it's another interlock.

 

[Coyote machine]

It sounds like you have a drain on your battery or very seldom use of teh tractor, either of which could drain a battery down. Having to replace one every two years is not normal.

To do the starter test, (to get it to crank over the engine, to see if the tractor will start this way) have someone sitting in the tractor's seat with a foot on the brake and the key OFF. Take a jumper wire from the post at the starter which comes from the battery, ( the positive cable) and touch the jumper to the small terminal on top of the solenoid. This should crank the battery IF and when you have your assistant put the ignition key in the ON position. IF the starter engages and the engine cranks over and starts you know the engine will start.

Now, assuming the engine did crank over, you have to go back and find where the starting circuit is dropping off. This means there is an open somewhere in the path from the chassis ground through the battery and on to the ignition switch and starter relay, seat switch, range selector switch, or any other safety device meant to keep the tractor from starting in gear, with the PTO on, etc.

But at least you know once you find where the circuit stops being a straight line path to the starter you have narrowed it down, and know once you find the open you will then be able to repair the circuit or component in the circuit which is causing the starter to not crank the engine.

Alternative save: take it to dealer and pay big $, but likely get it fixed sooner. Your choice.

 

[MikeS_in_GA]

Going out tomorrow. No helper, but I will see what I can do.

 

[k0ua]

I am confident you are not going to hurt yourself by letting the tractor run over you with your mechanical background. It is sad you did not get some electrical foundation under you in your "formative years". You may very well be suffering from the "rat chewed" syndrome since you have already found some damage. The rodents are not our friends. Even if you do jump the starter as coyote outlined so well, and you make the tractor run, what are you going to do then? The troubleshooting and wire tracing is then all still up to you. Can you do it? Do you want to do it?

Yes a person with a wiring diagram (schematic) and a VOM could likely fix your problem in short order.
Yes, I am still on my original battery and the battery is date coded 2010, so 7 years. But battery's vary, and some don't last long, and others last a long time. One key to making them last is a trickle charger when not in use. I use the little solar 1.5 watt trickle chargers and they sure have worked for me.

 

[MikeS_in_GA]

I have been using a hard wired trickle battery charger for a couple years. Batteries with an 18 month warranty, last about 25 months for me. I wish I could get a long lasting battery!

My local Kubota dealer is busy and can't do anything until Friday at the earliest. So I have tomorrow to give it another look. They did ask about the fuse by the starter. I've never noticed that, so I will look for it tomorrow.