ULSD and Power Service - question

[SkyPup]

Skypup
I also read that biodiesel still has the same lubrication qualities as regular sulfur diesel but not as much emissions.

Nope, 100% wrong -> Biodiesel has even HIGHER NOx emissions that petro diesel......

 

[gemini5362]

Chevron has a question and answer page about ULSD Diesel Fuels Question and Answers - New s15 ULSD Regulations it tells why you cant use anything other than ULSD in 2007 diesel engines. Evidently the new engines will have a catalytic converter and EGR valve. I would imagine that will help with emissions more than anything and I would guess that probably sulfur would cause havoc with the emission control systems. It does mention that the american standards has set a new standard for diesel engines because of the loss of lubricity. They also mention that although they dont see any wear problems they do see the new diesel possibly affecting seals on some engines.

 

[gemini5362]

Ok so I still stand by my first opinion that GM is not introducing 2007 diesel engines until actually in 2007 because they are trying to get them ready to go. And probably because of the cost of the new equipment they are waiting as long as possible to spring that increase on the public.

I imagine that the reason european cars are not sold in the US with diesel engines is because they already have Exhaust Emission controls on the vehicles and they could not run without ULSD.

From the small amount of reading I did it seems like the ULSD does not lower emissions. The new emissions equipment on the trucks will do that. They have to use ULSD to keep from clogging up the emisson equipment with sulfur

 

[gemini5362]

This page is a reference to the issue of lower lubrication.
http://www.epa.gov/cleandiesel/presentations/lubricityupdate.pdf

 

[HGM]

Well, the cats are only a portion of it.. There have been cat's(and EGR's) on diesels for years with little trouble unless the owner ran hi sulfer off road fuel.. The sulfer would actually clogg the converter.. The funny thing is, that if it wasnt bad enough to keep it from running a fresh tank of LSD would clean it out.. The ULSD does reduce left over soot(from burnt sulfer) the way I understand it. The particulate traps will be the BIG issue.. The life expectancy will be over 100k miles but with contaminated fuel or "hi sulfer", it will drasticly reduce its life..

Ok so I still stand by my first opinion that GM is not introducing 2007 diesel engines until actually in 2007 because they are trying to get them ready to go. And probably because of the cost of the new equipment they are waiting as long as possible to spring that increase on the public.

I imagine that the reason european cars are not sold in the US with diesel engines is because they already have Exhaust Emission controls on the vehicles and they could not run without ULSD.

Sounds correct to me.. There are big changes coming, and its not over yet. I also understand that the fuel will be changing again in 2010, removing yet another 95% of the sulfer..I've even heard the comment that the exhaust from a diesel can be expected to be cleaner than the air in LA..

 

[SkyPup]

From the small amount of reading I did it seems like the ULSD does not lower emissions. The new emissions equipment on the trucks will do that. They have to use ULSD to keep from clogging up the emisson equipment with sulfur

Keep on reading.....


ULSD immediately lowers SOx (Sulfur Oxide species) emissions 95% in ALL diesel engines, new and old.

ULSD immediately lowers <5um particulates by 95% in all diesel engines, new and old.

ULSD immediately lowers Soot by 95% in all diesel engines, new and old.

ULSD also immediately lowers PNAs (PolyNuclearAromatics) by greater than 80% in all diesels, new and old.

 

[penokee]

Some interesting reading on the subject. States that removal of the sulphur reduces the lubricity and recommends a fuel additive such as Stanadyne or Power Service. This appears to me to be a fairly authoritative source, but then again what do I know.
penokee

TheDieselPage.com - 2006 - Diesel Technology Forum Presents "Clean Diesel, Clean Air"

 

[MadReferee]

Some interesting reading on the subject. States that removal of the sulphur reduces the lubricity and recommends a fuel additive such as Stanadyne or Power Service. This appears to me to be a fairly authoritative source, but then again what do I know.
penokee

TheDieselPage.com - 2006 - Diesel Technology Forum Presents "Clean Diesel, Clean Air"

The only recommendation they give is to use additional additives until such time as the fuel industry can prove that the additives they are required to add actually cause the fuel to meet the current lubricity standard.

They are telling their members that they don't trust the oil companies.

I am not loosing sleep over it and neither should you.

 

[SkyPup]

Didn't all the millions of diesel engines all over California and Texas (which accounts for > 50% of all diesel fuel consumed in the USA) immediately blow up when they switched over to ULSD many years ago?

Boy, those all those fuel injection equipment manufacturers must have made a royal killing off that disaster.....

In fact, the entire ULSD mandate must have been purely a conspiracy for the big FIE manufacturers to maximize profits and rip off all the owners of broken down diesel engines all over North America.

BIG OIL and the FIE makers must have specifically conspired to destroy every American diesel engine with the help of crooked politicans, handsomely paid lobbyists, and extraterrestial aliens who own stock in these corporations.....

 

[Dargo]

Gee, I guess I'm glad I'm fat, dumb, and happy on diesel fuel. I can give one new observation on the ULSD though. I just towed about 18,000 pounds of a load behind my 8000 pound pickup for about 800 miles. Leaving cruise control on about 75 mph, I noticed that I still was blowing out plenty of black smoke when going up the looooong 7% grades on some interstates. The passenger side rear bumper of my old '96 Dodge is no longer chrome. It looks to be a nice flat black now.

So, even though I noticed less smoke, you can still certainly get plenty of black smoke from the ULSD when under an extreme load. Well, at least what I consider an extreme load. I figure that moving around 26,000 pounds at 75 mph up a 7% grade to be an extreme load for a pickup, but that's just me.