Which would you pick and why?

[coasterez]

Well Dargo,

I was speaking of comparing gas powered machines (like a craftsman or yardman) to diesel tractors of similar hp. You certainly did not exclude these by your statements.

Hmm if we should be comparing your 22 hp ztr to a CK20, I wonder which would win in a back-to-back pull competition? Don't be rediculous! These machines aren't even near similar in purpose or construction. Of course, your ZTR couldn't carry 1500 lbs effectively. It wasn't designed for that purpose any more than the CK is designed to turn on a dime a 8 mph. Your comparisons are like comparing a Mustang GT to an F250. Similar hp, but not similar torque, nor frame design, nor axles, ...yada yada. What about a HP/weight comparison here? Who's fatest in the 1/4 mile? Who tows the most? Which can haul 2000 lbs? Which will stop the fastest? It's an obsurd comparison!

The CK20 is no more under powered than my old 10 hp Gravely rider was. That little rider was super heavy, direct drive tranny, shaft drive mower, and it would out pull and power most belt drive gas machines of 20+ hp made today. How? Because of design!

The point is it's not about the weight alone. It's about the machine design as a whole - gear ratios, transmission, torque, hp, transfer mechanisms, etc. and what the machine was designed to do. Who would ever compare a CUT to a ZTR! Or even a CUT to a riding mower!

 

[Dargo]

Similar hp, but not similar torque,...

Oh, really. I think you should look that one up and compare. My 28 hp diesel ZTR has considerably more torque than a CK20. We'll just have to agree to disagree. For what the original poster is wanting to do, his only logical choice is the CK30 gear. Since I have spent hundreds of hours in the seat of small and heavy CUTs, I stick by my guns that the CK20 and, especially the CK25 hydro, are underpowered for what the original poster wants.

Silly me, I should know that comparing 3 cylinder diesel engines to 3 cylinder diesel engines is comparing apples to oranges...

**Quick quiz: On a Ferris ZTR mower, which has the most torque, the 33.5 hp Cat diesel or the 35 hp B&S gas engine? I'm sure you'd say that the CK20, or even the CK30, has more torque than the cheap ole B&S gas engine, huh? You are so convinced that all diesel engines are superior on torque, I'll let you look that one up.

 

[coasterez]

Curious, Dargo,

How many CK25's have you used on actual jobs? You imply that they are under powered. Do you have real information to qualify your "fact". I've yet to find a task that even begins to tax the power of my CK25.

 

[coasterez]

Just like comparing 8 cylinder mustangs to 8 cylinder pickups. They are apples to oranges....And I bet my CK25 would pull that ZTR around like a rag doll because it wasn't designed for pulling no matter how much torque it has. It just can't put it's torque to the ground. Totally stupid comparison!

 

[Dargo]

Curious, Dargo,

How many CK25's have you used on actual jobs? You imply that they are under powered. Do you have real information to qualify your "fact". I've yet to find a task that even begins to tax the power of my CK25.

Oops, my bad; I didn't even know that you have a CK25. Actually, my Kioti dealer proved to me that the CK25 has the worst power to weight ratio of the entire Kioti line. He showed me in moving piles of landscaping rock with the FEL of several tractors. Sorry.

Since I've hit a nerve because of the tractor you bought, I'll just say that I still stand firm that the logical choice for the original poster is the CK30 gear.

 

[coasterez]

Well Jodanh,

I hope you don't apply Dargo's logic or you might try to do your tasks with a ZTR. Logic is that any of the CK's would be a fine choice, as would a lot of other TRACTORS.

 

[Dargo]

Just like comparing 8 cylinder mustangs to 8 cylinder pickups.

Uh, you do know that in several cases they use the exact same engine, don't you?

 

[coasterez]

No real nerve struck; I don't care what you or anyone else thinks of my purchase. I know what my machines will do. But, your statements are misleading and incorrect. And you don't even know first hand. It's irresponsible to spout off as fact that which you do not know. Your Kioti dealer... give me a break! If that is your Kioti dealer's opinion, then that is all you should have stated... that it was HIS opinion. You shouldn't have an opiniono cause you haven't used one, any more than I should talk about some machine that I have no experience with.

 

[coasterez]

So, are you arguing that the sky is azure not blue, or are you arguing that one should actually compare a mustang to a pickup?

 

[Dargo]

But, your statements are misleading and incorrect.

While we disagree on which Kioti the poster should buy, I draw the line here. You, sir, have painted yourself into a corner from which you cannot escape. You have called me a liar. I have used facts and logic and have not resorted to simply calling you stupid. Prove what I said is incorrect or misleading or ride off on your Kioti and be happy with what you bought. Otherwise I'll have to continue to point out things like you are saying that you are more informed on Kioti than a dealer, you cannot read that the dealer and I used the Kioti tractors to move landscaping rock, and that you keep spouting incorrect theories about how engines and torque cannot be compared.

Is there some reason you don't want the original poster to buy a Kioti??! I've suggested the CK30, and nothing else, three times. You seem to want to suggest anything but a Kioti. Are there issues you need to discuss about Kioti?


Sorry JordanH, Jon DePratt will take good care of you and I think you'll do well sticking with the Kioti line for your needs. Good luck with whatever you buy! Jon will steer you the right way; I'd take his advice.