Low water pressure questions ( well system )

[sailorman]

I have low water pressure in my house to the point that if I flush a toilet I get practically no water anywhere else .

Stats : 2 story house. 2 full baths. clothes washer, dish washer, water heater, 3 outdoor spigots. Shallow well ( maybe 125 ft ) . Jet pump . Water tank rated at max. 75 psi ( I think non-bladder type ). Iron filter installed . 30/50 switch . Very old air volume control. Pressure gauge on tank ( shows normal 30/50 psi ). No nipple to pump air into tank.

What I 've done : I drained tank several times in the hope that tank was water logged ( No help ) . I changed from a 20/40 switch to the 30/50 switch ( slight, but unacceptable pressure gain ).

Only thing I can think of to change is the 30/50 switch to a 40/60 switch and replace old air volume control. Any reason I shouldn 't do this ?

Sure could use ya 'll 's advice and suggestions .

 

[sdkubota]

Do you have any idea of what kind of flow rates the well is capable of producing? Some wells do not have much flow capacity, if that is the case increasing your pressure will not help.

 

[uglyboywith11fingers]

In our area, a 125 ft well is not called a shallow well. My well is shallow, a 25 ft dug well, usually 10 ft of water in it.
If the pressure guage on your tank shows normal pressure... then maybe you've got a flow problem, not a pressure problem. Do you have a good flow when the pump is running ? Maybe iron filter clogged ?
When you draw water, does the pump start almost immediately ? Is it running the whole time your toilet tank is re-filling, and then stop shortly after ? Then I'd say your tank is water-logged. I'd recommend getting a bladder type pressure tank...

Pete

 

[sailorman]

sdKubota, I have no idea of flow rate. In fact I 'm not sure what well flow rate means . Does it something to do with a well that has natural pressure and flows without a pump ?

 

[sailorman]

Uglyboy, shallow well is just my term compared say a 950 ft well . Pressure gauge operates with the 30/50 switch range . I have good flow when pump is running, but it takes time for the pressure to become good after it has dropped too low . At what location in the system would an iron clog occur ? Pump does not run the whole time toilet is filling . It seems to cycle at the 30/50 setting . The pressure in house is very poor when the rank pressure drops below 40 and pump does not kick on until pressure reaches 30 .

I was thinkin' bladder tank also . Just want to make sure there was not a quick fix or diagnosis I 've missed before the new expense .

 

[sdkubota]

I have no idea of flow rate. In fact I 'm not sure what well flow rate means . Does it something to do with a well that has natural pressure and flows without a pump ?

Just refers to the gallons per minute the well can produce. Some wells can produce 1,000 gpm while others maybe 1 gpm. If there is a outside hydrant near the well try filling a 5 gal bucket and record the amount of time it takes to the best of your ability. There are also well logs available from the driller or state that will say the specifics of a well provided in was drilled in the not so distant past.

 

[Domush]

It means the gallons per minute the pump is rated for. If your toilet fills at 5 gallons per minute and your pump is a 7 gl/ min pump, your water pressure will suck the second the pressure tank dips. If your pump has a decent flow rate you are looking at a piping issue, a restriction somewhere. Remember, the pipes have to be able to deliver the water fast enough to make you happy. Make sure your feeder pipes are large enough, say, 3/4 inch or larger, and remain that big until they split off to the various faucets.

It should be noted, a pressure tank will only fix very short burst pressure issues, and will not fix a shower and flushing toilet situation, only a better pump, less restrictive piping can fix that. The tank is essentially bypassed in long run examples, like showering and sprinklers or spigots turned on for more than a few seconds.

The pressure tank is there to extend the life of your pump and even out pressure, not increase pressure.

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[sailorman]

Just refers to the gallons per minute the well can produce. Some wells can produce 1,000 gpm while others maybe 1 gpm. If there is a outside hydrant near the well try filling a 5 gal bucket and record the amount of time it takes to the best of your ability.

I ve got a spigot right at the well house that comes off of piping after the tank . Will that be a good place to measure flow rate ?

 

[BobRip]

My neighbor had a similar problem. They found that a pipe was blocked with rust. The remaining opening was about the size of a pencil. As I remember it the clogged line was between the air injector and the iron filter tank. The air injector causes the iron to combine with oxygen to form iron oxide (rust) and that collected on the walls of the pipe. They replaced it with a larger pipe and clean it periodically or replace it. It is only a few feet long.

 

[uglyboywith11fingers]

At what location in the system would an iron clog occur ? Pump does not run the whole time toilet is filling . It seems to cycle at the 30/50 setting . The pressure in house is very poor when the tank pressure drops below 40 and pump does not kick on until pressure reaches 30 .

you mentioned you had an iron filter installed... if it is located after the pressure tank (as I would expect) maybe it is clogged ?
I'm in a 2 storey house with system running 30-50psi, 3 bathrooms, etc. I can shower upstairs while 2 toilets get flushed & barely notice anything. If as you say the pump cycles on & off just filling the toilet tank, but you got little flow elsewhere in the house, I'd say you got a flow restriction somewhere... maybe a shut-off valve not fully open ??? I don't have/need an iron filter so have no knowledge of them.

Pete

 

[BobRip]

I ve got a spigot right at the well house that comes off of piping after the tank . Will that be a good place to measure flow rate ?

Yes. Take a five gallon bucket and time how long it takes to fill it. If it takes one minute then you have a flow of five gallons per minute. It should be at least that much. If you get good flow there then the problem is further down stream.

 

[sdkubota]

I ve got a spigot right at the well house that comes off of piping after the tank . Will that be a good place to measure flow rate ?

That would be a good place. Let the water run for say 10 minutes then take fill your bucket and record the number of seconds it takes. If the well is not producing much flow could be the well screen is plugged, the well pump isn't large enough, or the well just can't produce a large amount of water in a short amount of time.

 

[Domush]

I have good flow when pump is running, but it takes time for the pressure to become good after it has dropped too low .

Well that is a super easy fix! Your pressure switch is out of adjustment for your pressure tank. Adjust your cut-in pressure so the pump kicks on sooner.

Do a search for "well pressure switch adjustment". It is very easy if a hose is nearby to monitor water pressure.

What you want is the pump to kick on before pressure is noticeably affected and off as just short of the Max your pump can manage (but below your pressure tanks Max pressure rating)

Easy fix

Just remember, high water pressure isn't free. You get it at the expense of your pumps life. Higher pressures = shorter pump lifespan, so don't go crazy thinking fire hose pressure is ideal.

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[sailorman]

you mentioned you had an iron filter installed... if it is located after the pressure tank (as I would expect) maybe it is clogged ?

Yes I have an iron filter after the tank . I just bypassed the filter with a built in valve to test house flow . No big change so I must have a problem somewhere else in the system .

 

[sailorman]

Well that is a super easy fix! Your pressure switch is out of adjustment for your pressure tank. Adjust your cut-in pressure so the pump kicks on sooner.

My explanation may have been misleading . The pump cycles at the proper switch setting . But, the house pressure is no good once the tank pressure drops to 40 and below . The pump comes on at 30 and when the tank pressure reaches 40 or above the house pressure is ok .

I 'm thinkin I may have an obstructed line some where leading into the house . Possibly at the very old metal ( 30 + yrs. ) cut off valve to the house . I sure dread tryin ' to replace that . Pipes from tank are all plastic and then tie into a short I ( inches ) copper pipe, to metal valve, to copper pipe into the house .

 

[sailorman]

morning errand time now . I 'll check back for any more replies when I get back . Gonna hold off on the 40/60 switch until I check back here . Ya 'll have been great helpin' an old dude who knows he doesn 't know everything .

 

[sdkubota]

Supply pipes can become completely clogged with mineral/rust deposits over time. It can be a big problem not easily fixed or cheap.

 

[sdkubota]

morning errand time now . I 'll check back for any more replies when I get back . Gonna hold off on the 40/60 switch until I check back here . Ya 'll have been great helpin' an old dude who knows he doesn 't know everything .

When you are old...never admit you don't know everything!:thumbsup:

 

[meburdick]

It means the gallons per minute the pump is rated for. If your toilet fills at 5 gallons per minute and your pump is a 7 gl/ min pump, your water pressure will suck the second the pressure tank dips. If your pump has a decent flow rate you are looking at a piping issue, a restriction somewhere. Remember, the pipes have to be able to deliver the water fast enough to make you happy. Make sure your feeder pipes are large enough, say, 3/4 inch or larger, and remain that big until they split off to the various faucets.

It should be noted, a pressure tank will only fix very short burst pressure issues, and will not fix a shower and flushing toilet situation, only a better pump, less restrictive piping can fix that. The tank is essentially bypassed in long run examples, like showering and sprinklers or spigots turned on for more than a few seconds.

The pressure tank is there to extend the life of your pump and even out pressure, not increase pressure.

Sent from my SCH-I500 using TractorByNet

This is not correct. That is the flow rate of the pump. The flow rate of the well is how much water the well is capable of providing per minute over a period of time. What's typically looked for is the recovery rate of the well.

Recovery rate is how long it takes the aquifer to "refill" the well pipe after you've pumped water out of it. If the recovery rate is slower than the pump's flow rate, your pump will eventually hit a no-water condition if it runs continuously.

One thing that is often done is to get a flow restrictor that you can attach to a hose. Turn off all water use inside of the house, attach the hose outside with the flow restrictor, set it to 5PM, and turn the water on. Let it run for AT LEAST 30 minutes paying attention to sounds coming from the well head. You do not want to run the pump to a state where it's sucking air - if that happens, be prepared to kill the breaker for the pump immediately.

Once you know whether or not the well can keep up with your pump, and you can pump 5PM for an extended period of time, you can move on to correcting pressure issues inside of the house.

 

[Domush]

Easiest means to test your house plumbing is to install a spigot at the well house, then compare flow rates of a hose from your house to a hose at the well house. Big difference, it's plumbing related, tiny difference, it's your pressure switch adjustment.

Here is a good starting point for learning how a non-bladder tank works: Cycle Stop Valves, Inc.

There are more moving parts with a non-badder tank, so you may be losing pressure within the well pump piping from a sticking ball-valve. Either way, if your piping isn't the issue, you need to up your cut-in pressure. You may be able to adjust your 30/50 up enough to avoid having to get a 40/60. This is assuming your hydro pneumatic tank is working correctly, as without getting fresh air, it is a pointless tank, as water doesn't compress well and will mean your 80gl tank will only sustain pressure for a few gallons of water, max, without the ball valve in the piping feeding fresh air to refill it.