15-20k watt PTO emergency generator recommendations?

[Fallon]

I'm looking to pull the trigger on a PTO generator here in the next few months.

Kubota L3200, 25 PTO HP, which translates into 18k watts. I may end up with a beefier tractor later. Generally I'd rather get a little bit to big of a generator than to small of one. It's easy to run a big generator with a lesser load than the other way around & if the load on a bigger generator is more HP than I have I just stall rather than breaking something. I'm not sure of our peak or average power draw, but am confident I can manually manage things as needed. It's trivial to shut off the hot water heater or the A/C we have yet to install.

I'll be getting a manual transfer switch & this is for emergency use, not really standby use. It gets cold here in Colorado, so I want to make sure I can heat the place, but am not that worried about an hour or 2 of power outage. We haven't had anything over an hour or 2 so far in the year and a half I've lived at our current place. There is a good chance I'd use it for some other stuff away from power from time to time as well, but not often.

15k watts = 62.5@ at 240, so a single 50@ 240v might be pushing things if I'm trying to run the whole shebang through 1 socket. That does seem to be what most of the generators I've seen.

Harbor Freight has a 16000 Peak/15000 Running Watts Tractor-Driven PTO Generator for $1.5k (before I dig up a 20% off coupon). That includes a frame & PTO shaft.

Northern Tool has NorthStar PTO Generator 13,000 Watt, 24 HP Required for about $1.5k with no PTO shaft or mounting frame.

RuralKing has 24,000KW Rural King PTO Generator for $1.5k & a 50KW for $2.3k that has a 63@ plug. Not clear if those are single phase or 3 phase though, looks like it might be able to do both. 3 phase would be handy for a rotary converter if I ever end up with a big lathe or mill out in my shop that runs on 3 phase, as long as it could pump out single phase for the house.

Any recommendations on these, or any others that are rated a bit higher? I've been keeping an eye on CraigsList, but haven't seen much show up in quite some time.

 

[buickanddeere]

Go with a large single phase. It's not a good idea to operate a commercial generator at or near 100% load . As for the three phase motor, a variable frequency drive to make three phase from single phase beats any rotary converter .

 

[bcp]

Harbor Freight has a 16000 Peak/15000 Running Watts Tractor-Driven PTO Generator for $1.5k (before I dig up a 20% off coupon). That includes a frame & PTO shaft.

Some, if not all, of the HF coupons of which I've read the fine print, exempted generators.

Bruce

 

[shawnspeed]

Just a word of caution on buying too large a genset for a pto...it will severely lug the tractor and give you an under voltage situation that will possibly cost you some cash with burned up stuff like refrigerators, freezers, sump pumps ect...I would buy a little smaller and have some extra HP for the serge loads. A good friend of mine has a dairy farm and has several PTO gen sets...one is a 75 or 100 KW ...it makes his MF 1155 bark( 150 pto hp) when the coolers & vacuum pump in the milking parlor both are on..last year during the ice storm he went thru 3500 bucks in diesel for the week...they do load the tractor...even with light loads...just some food for thought...Shawn

 

[s219]

I don't think you can take the rated PTO HP and assume you can produce an equivalent amount of electrical energy in kW. There will be losses in the mechanical to electrical conversion, so the electrical output will be less.

When shopping for my diesel generator (eventually got one with Isuzu 4CYL 4LE1 engine) I was seeing 3-6 kW of disparity between the diesel engine's power at 1800rpm and the output electrical power from the generator head, for units in the 20-25kW range. Some of that is due to losses, some surely comes from running the engines at less than 100% load to provide some reserve and factor of safety. So anyway, don't plan to get all of the 18kW from a 25HP PTO based on a straight HP to kW conversion. I think for a 25HP PTO, assuming the generator is geared so that you are running the tractor at the rated RPM to achieve that 25HP at the PTO shaft, plan on more like 12-15kW of reliable electrical power.

I'd suggest being conservative with the generator requirements so that the tractor engine can maintain output and the generator can maintain voltage. Electrical generation has a fairly narrow margin when running appliances, electronics, etc.

I don't know the implications of hooking up a large generator head to a lower-rated engine, but knowing the engine will be running at constant RPM and power delivery will vary based on loading and balanced by fuel input, I can see how a large capacity generator head (like the 24kW and 50kW Rural King models you cited) could really lug down a 24HP engine. Even if you don't plan to load the generator to the full amount, the potential is there to really beat on the engine.

 

[aczlan]

There are a couple of people on here who have way oversized gensets on their machines (30kw on 18HP?). IIRC, they use a breaker sized to the tractor output to limit current draw to what the tractor engine can handle.
So, if the engine can handle 30 amps, it gets a 30 amp breaker even if the genset came equipped with a 100 amp breaker.
A larger genset will take a little more power to keep spinning, but it will also handle larger surge loads.

Aaron Z

 

[zzvyb6]

I frequently use a 50kW Winpower PTO unit behind my 35 hp JD. Never had a problem. Often used it behind my 22 hp Yanmar. Bought it at a Farm auction for about $1000 as I recall. Came with all the switch gear and cables. Often use it for non-emergency applications, too. That includes welding, tree spraying with my electric power washer, and even a hedge trimmer. I can even use it on my diesel lawnmower. So, its a contraption in someone's illiterate words. So what. I have power and they need a shower and a flush.

Never had to consider using the tractor for 'other things' when the power is out. You don't need electricity 24/7. Just when you want to pump up the well pressure tank, heat or cool the house and to surf the net for the power outage map.

 

[Fallon]

I appreciate the conversion losses & what not. For now its just our well, propane furnace, 2 fridges & a freezer along with lights. I'm confident we can manage the load to the lowest common denominator. We wouldn't be running it 24/7, just enough to keep the house warm, watered & the food cold.

I'm sure I can see how well my governor & the other components work giving it a calibrated workout with my welder. Can add enough load that wont wig out when I reach the limit & see what it is.

Making sure that weak link is a breaker rather than lugging the engine sounds like a great idea.

Still looking for advise on what the best or at least most economical option is for a new generator is. Still hoping for a Craigslist or auction find for cheap, but no luck in quite some time so far.

 

[newbury]

<snip>and to surf the net for the power outage map.

AND TO GET ON TBN!!

<snip>
Still looking for advise on what the best or at least most economical option is for a new generator is. Still hoping for a Craigslist or auction find for cheap, but no luck in quite some time so far.

Go to Harbor Freight TODAY and get their little 1K gennie for $90 (Black Friday special, online also). Swap out the sparkplug. Break it in and baby it. You've now got enough for a few lights etc.

And constantly search CL, auctions etc. if you are seriously trying to save $$$.

I was in a similar situation, badly wanting a PTO generator, and after about a year of searching my local area found one, an almost new Winco 12KW, for $600 w/ PTO shaft and pallets it's mounted on. Over the years I've seen several more, usually larger, but they are rare and often heavily used. And set aside $100/month for a good name brand one. A generator is not something I'd cut corners on if I'm spending a decent amount.

 

[s219]

There are a couple of people on here who have way oversized gensets on their machines (30kw on 18HP?). IIRC, they use a breaker sized to the tractor output to limit current draw to what the tractor engine can handle.
So, if the engine can handle 30 amps, it gets a 30 amp breaker even if the genset came equipped with a 100 amp breaker.
A larger genset will take a little more power to keep spinning, but it will also handle larger surge loads.

That is a great idea -- simple and effective way to limit things safely.

 

[Fallon]

I have a 3 or 4kw Coleman gas generator I got at a garage sale a few years ago for under $100. If push came to shove I could do the extension cord thing. It probably wouldn't run the well pump.

Looking for a longer term whole house system even if I have to manage the load a bit.

 

[katoomed00]

17kw will run my entire all electric home, AC, Lights, induction cooktop, hot water heater, water well and so on. Now I'm not saying it will handle everything coming on at the same time. You can always turn off breakers as well.

Rural King is what I own.

 

[BAP]

I would look at a quality PTO generator like Winpower, WINCO PTO Generators, who has been around a long time, or Baumalight, BaumaLight - PTO Generators. I have a Baumalight TX-12 that I run with my Kubota B2920. The thing with generators is that it takes x-amount of HP to run them at full output. If you only draw off a certain amount of power that is less than the full rated output, you can get by with lesser HP.

 

[Soundguy]

I have that north star 13k unit. Run it behind mostly old tractors, works good for mobile welding or power tools or well pump on the farm. I mounted mine on a palate and that to a carry all for 3pt hookup

 

[JRL305]

When we built our place, we put in a 200 gal propane tank then only put in a gas range. Since we experience a couple of outages a year, some lasting hours, I put in a Generac 20k propane unit with the automatic transfer switch. I runs literally everything. I didn't have my tractor then so I really didn't have a choice. Even now, I'd go with the current setup. I have a 5500 portable gas unit and it's really a pain with all the extension cords and having to fill it up every 10 hours or so if the outage is for days, not hours. Even then, I don't think it would handle the well, fridges and hot water heater. Everyone has different needs and resources. I'd say, PLAN CAREFULLY.

 

[ns_in_tex]

about 14 years ago we purchased a 17 KW/35KW surge capacity pto generator from "The Power Connection"
It came on its own trailer with PTO shaft, delivered to us for 2500.00
It is a 1800 RPM, brushless generator, with large surge capacity for starting motors.

The Power Connection, Inc. - Generator solutions for home and agriculture

 

[daybreak1998]

Howdy,
Your tractor can turn a 60kw unit if you wanted. The amount of power produced will be limited by the smallest link in the chain. If your tractor is 24hp at the pto shaft, your theoretical maximum power would be approx. 13.10kw. Having a larger than needed PTO generator will help with power surges, motor starts, and power demand changes. The larger PTO generators also can be quieter because they can be found with a 1800 RPM internal rotation speed. That means 1800 RPM for a 4 pole generator or 3600 RPM for a 2 pole generator. The power requirement changes will be smoothed out by a larger rotating mass. Plus you would be prepared for a larger tractor in the future. The future changes would need to be kept in mind when making a connection to your house. You obviously would not want a 30amp twist lock, and would miss out on the full power from your unit you decide to buy. I made a post which list a few ways to connect. The things you will need to think about when you decide on what to buy. Some PTO generator are designed better than others. Look at the specs of the PTO generators with constant full power output, and surge output. 1800rpm internal generators will cost more. They run quieter. They will last longer. No matter which you select, the PTO shaft need to spin at 540rpm. It is not a matter of only needing a little amount of power. The power output needs to be 240volts @ 60Hz cycle.
generator transfer switch connection choices

Some items to ponder.
pros;
do not have another engine to maintain
larger power options
cheaper
can be re-sold at a good price if needed
does not need to be maintenance run monthly
portable to where you need it
cons;
not automatic
have to connect

Some will chime in stating that after a storm you need your tractor. Sure, you might need it, but will you be using your tractor around the clock? Some might say they don't want to put hours on their tractor... I dunno, diesel tractors are meant to work.

 

[Dave M7040]

The one consideration I have not heard in this thread is the ability of other members of the household to run the complicated arrangements such as starting the tractor, connecting the pto shaft and making the electrical connections. I am 68 and until I was badly injured never gave dealing with emergencies a second thought. Suddenly my wife of 45 years was faced with equipment she could not handle to keep us both safe and warm. A Generac 20 kw running on propane gives us both a big piece of mind. I do have a new Kubota M7040 but feel it is an impractical way to provide power in a hurry on a dark stormy night. I remember being young and on very limited funds. My suggestion is to try and get a setup that a neighbor or friend could get up and running without a big instruction book. Simple things like not running the tractor at the correct pto speed to produce the proper 60 cycle power can cause a lot of damage to your home electronics and appliances. A small portable unit with electric start and a Generlink connection at your utility meter would be my low cost recommendation.
Dave M7040

 

[MikePA]

The one consideration I have not heard in this thread is the ability of other members of the household to run the complicated arrangements such as starting the tractor, connecting the pto shaft and making the electrical connections.

You're right on both counts; It was not mentioned in this thread but was mentioned in this thread, Post #26. In addition to all the considerations people normally take into account, when they think they have a solution, they should ask the question, "If we lose power and I'm not available, can my spouse implement my solution?" And by 'not available' I mean just that. Your spouse can't call you, can't email you, can't ask you questions, etc. Write down all the steps they'd need to do from the time power goes out to the time power is restored. Is there anything they can't do, or need trained to do? Are there things they shouldn't do? Breakers that need to be turned on/off?