Wind Turbine ********. Just opened the mail and seen the plan for three massive units

[Creamer]

May not be a subsidy, but the tax breaks are certainly big enough.

Really? Are you bringing up this old hackneyed subject again? The oil companies get no special tax breaks as compared to other corporations. All companies get to deduct the costs of doing business and one of those costs for oil companies is searching for and developing new sources. The fact that they have billions of dollars of expenses is because they are spending billions dollars of money because they need to to support their ongoing operations.

This is nothing like a Solindra - it is standard deduction for expenses for normal operations no different than a farmer's costs to plant and tend crops or manufacturer's costs incurred to make product.

 

[dave1949]

Subsies, no. Tax breaks yes, just like I do. Do the oil companies PAY taxes, yes they do.

Last time I checked, if I install a PV system in NC I will get 65% of that money back from NC state and the Feds. Eventually. If that 65% subsidy went away, what would happen to the solar power business in NC? If we took away all of the tax breaks the oil companies and everyone else gets, which I am in favor of doing, will Exxon still be in business?

Later,
Dan

Will the Army Corps of Engineers be dredging rivers and harbors for your next boat load of sunshine? Taxpayer funded subsidies and supports come in many flavors.

Yes, Exxon will go out of business if you have to pay the real costs of oil and gas.

 

[aczlan]

Taxpayer funded subsidies and supports come in many flavors.
Yes, Exxon will go out of business if you have to pay the real costs of oil and gas.

As will any business if you tax them on their gross income without allowing any deductions for expenses.

Aaron Z

 

[Creamer]

Yes, Exxon will go out of business if you have to pay the real costs of oil and gas.

Big statement - anything to back it up?

 

[Creamer]

As will any business if you tax them on their gross income without allowing any deductions for expenses.

If all businesses have the same tax burden then it will all equal out and the prices will go up for the consumer but corporations exist to make a return on their investment. If the general prices go up because of changed tax policy they will still make a profit.

The problem I have is that all we have done is shift how the taxes are paid - since the corporations are paying more taxes they are raising their prices to collect more money to hand it over to the government. the bottom line is that corporations never really pay taxes they do collect other people's money and hand it over but this is just indirect personal taxation. The corporation will make a return on its investment at whatever level its investors require as set by the market. The consumers pay one way or the other.

 

[dave1949]

Big statement - anything to back it up?

If you need to ask, you've been living in a vacuum for the past 20 years. If you haven't learned anything by now, nothing I can say would help you.

 

[Creamer]

If you need to ask, you've been living in a vacuum for the past 20 years. If you haven't learned anything by now, nothing I can say would help you.

Thank you all knowing one. I can appreciate your arrogance. Sorry to have bothered you!

But we both know the truth is that this is your paradigm and how dare I ask you - the great one - to substantiate any outlandish claim.

 

[dave1949]

As will any business if you tax them on their gross income without allowing any deductions for expenses.

Aaron Z

How do you know this? If all businesses are treated equally, then whether the the government foregoes tax revenue from a given business activity segment or consumers pay the actual costs wrapped into pricing makes no difference. Someone pays somehow. There is no magic money.

In any case, tax policy is the least of the real costs of oil and gas.

 

[dave1949]

Thank you all knowing one. I can appreciate your arrogance. Sorry to have bothered you!

But we both know the truth is that this is your paradigm and how dare I ask you - the great one - to substantiate any outlandish claim.

Enjoy your vacuum.

 

[buickanddeere]

Yup, I've got a nuke plant that just shut down about 5 miles from my door step.

There is 100 acres that will be inaccessible for then next 10,000 years.

The actual footprint of the reactor and zone 3 will be about one acre. Everything is radioactive, it's a matter of how radioactive. Do we post a radiation sign over your septic tank after you eat bananas which are loaded with radioactive potassium 40. Even the used fuel after 250 years is down to only 4-5 rem per hour. If you are waiting for radioactive materials to fission down to zero. You had better remove and bury the granite counter tops in your kitchen for hundreds of thousands of years.