40 Acres, Steep!, 1 Mile Road; Need Advice

oosik · Dec 10, 2018

Pugemasta - Look at the pics that MtViewRanch has posted showing his driveway and how the LPGS works. When you have a driveway that is topped with all gravel - the LPGS will do a GREAT job. When you have a driveway such as mine - exposed bedrock and house sized boulders - the LPGS doesn't really do so really well.

I use my LPGS mostly out and about on the property to create new trails and upkeep on existing ones.

I have found the my hydraulic top link from Brian @ MtViewRanch works wonders on all my land engagement implements - even when hooking up my Wally chipper.

So - I use my big 'ol Rhino 950 rear blade almost exclusively to maintain my mile long gravel driveway. After going thru the process of getting the top link set just right - this means - stop, twist, go 50', stop, twist, go 50 feet etc, etc, etc. Finally you end up saying - "Well, that's good enough".

With the hydraulic top link - motor along - a slight touch of the hydraulic control - how does it look - another touch of the hydraulic control - check again. All this while you are still sitting on the tractor and the tractor is still motoring along. Its so darn easy to make adjustments and you continue until it is set perfectly. Once I got the unit - it really upset me that I didn't get it a whole lot sooner.

A note of caution - the Rhino 950 - 8 foot - 1100 pounds is bigger than Kubota recommends for my M6040. They recommend a max of 7 foot width and 1200 pounds. You can't win for loosing in this case. And strangely this mis-match is prevalent thru all the implement size/weight matches that Kubota recommends. There isn't a 7 foot rear blade that can be offset sufficiently for me to safely maintain the ditches on my driveway. A 7 foot blade will simply put the tractor too close to the edge in many areas and I don't relish getting that close - especially when the driveway is icy and I'm plowing snow.

So - bottom line. Take a long look at what the manufacturer recommends for implements in the Owners Manual for any tractor you are considering. You CAN get too big an implement and cause damage to the 3-point.

Pugemasta · Dec 10, 2018

Thanks Brian! Appreciate the photos, very helpful for me. Sounds like I should consider a grading scraper as well when I buy the tractor, the road is (mostly) gravel. May skip the landscape rake for now and see how it goes. I'll need to read the gravel road manual Egon shared as well. Wish I was shopping for a fleet like yours

I know where to go for an aftermarket T&T kit.

Thanks Oosik, I will need to give some more thought to blade length after selecting a tractor. You make a good argument for getting a blade on the larger end. I don't like the idea of getting any closer to the edge of my road than needed, particularly in winter. I will probably stay within the recommended range of the manufacturer, just to be conservative.

oosik · Dec 10, 2018

My 2009 Kubota M6040 crossed the ADM grain scales in Cheney @ 10,100 pound with the Rhino Rear blade and Land Pride grapple on board.View attachment 582543 View attachment 582544

MtnViewRanch · Dec 10, 2018

Pugemasta said:
Thanks Brian! Appreciate the photos, very helpful for me. Sounds like I should consider a grading scraper as well when I buy the tractor, the road is (mostly) gravel. May skip the landscape rake for now and see how it goes. I'll need to read the gravel road manual Egon shared as well. Wish I was shopping for a fleet like yours I know where to go for an aftermarket T&T kit.

Thanks Oosik, I will need to give some more thought to blade length after selecting a tractor. You make a good argument for getting a blade on the larger end. I don't like the idea of getting any closer to the edge of my road than needed, particularly in winter. I will probably stay within the recommended range of the manufacturer, just to be conservative.

Forgot to mention, most of my roads are all DG, same material that you have to deal with. If the road it built properly, even with only DG, no imported material, (rocks and 3/4" gravel, it will stay in pretty good shape. Mine does, but then I have no where the amount of foul weather that you have.

MtnViewRanch · Dec 10, 2018

oosik said:
Pugemasta - Look at the pics that MtViewRanch has posted showing his driveway and how the LPGS works. When you have a driveway that is topped with all gravel - the LPGS will do a GREAT job. When you have a driveway such as mine - exposed bedrock and house sized boulders - the LPGS doesn't really do so really well.

I use my LPGS mostly out and about on the property to create new trails and upkeep on existing ones.

oosik, remember when you had your smaller rear blade, it was simply to light to work for your road other than for snow. Do you think that the same thing would apply for your LPGS? Your LPGS is 8' wide and weighs less than 1000lbs, what if you had one that was 1400-1500lbs? Would that make a difference, or still just not enough weight? :confused3: Not that you need it since you have the heavy rear blade now.

Just curious what your thoughts are on that.

Pugemasta · Dec 11, 2018

That's good to hear about the DG and roads, Brian. It looks like the previous owner found a clean pocket of DG and has been using it to sand the road. Nice to know that's a practical idea.

I have some remaining Qs for you all, I'm just going to list all at once. Happy with whatever info you are able to offer:

1) which valves should I choose for remotes? Have tried to research some, but it's over my head still and don't want to make a mistake. I'll mostly be using grading implements. Maybe a PTO driven front or rear pull snowblower and who knows what else in the future. I believe the Branson 5220 is limited to three rear remotes and you can add a third function to the FEL.

2) is a T&T kit needed for a box blade or LPGS? Thinking I may go with just the top link and hydraulic back blade to save money and complexity. Note that I'm planning on getting a backhoe attachment as well and I anticipate taking it on/off quite a bit.

3) weights: suitcase? Ballast box? Wheel weight's? Fill tires? You all have recommended filling the tires and getting a ballast box. Should I simply get as many suitcase and wheel weights as I can if I want stability and traction? Is weight good for the steep, 25%+ grade portions of the road? I know I want to add weight, could use some help on how much and where.

4) what backhoe bucket size? Pin on ok? Planning to build culverts and install septic w/ the backhoe initially. Soil is pretty soft, DG.

5) hydraulic thumb worth the money? Looks pretty handy if one anticipates encountering large rocks.

6) pin on FEL bucket ok? I don't anticipate taking it off much.

7) I'm considering the Branson 5220h and maybe the MF 2706e. Am I buying too much HP? I don't think so due to the steep driveway and I want to be able to buy other attachments in the future that may or may not benefit from more PTO HP.

Thank you for helping aspiring owners like myself. Wish I could buy you all a drink :drink:

One dealer sells both MF and Branson in my town, so not much of a chance to shop around. I don't think Kubota will work out due to budget. I'll check out the Branson/MF dealer on Friday and will let you know how it goes. Won't be ready to buy for at least a week after that.

MossRoad · Dec 11, 2018

I'd get a skid steer quick attach on your FEL arms. It makes life a lot easier down the road. I'd also consider a grapple bucket and some pallet forks. I can't count the number of times I've popped off my bucket and picked up the forks to move items that were too large to fit in the bucket, like logs and larger rocks. My PT quick attach makes it a 15 second job without getting off the machine. A skid steer quick attach is almost as fast. Well worth it.

ericm979 · Dec 11, 2018

I would not get a pin on FEL bucket. You may want forks or a grapple. I like my grapple so much that I leave it on all the time and only switch to the bucket when I need to carry loose material. I have a lot of brush and trees to move. Most tractors come with SSQA standard now. Branson does.

Tilt is really useful for box blades. Is it useful enough to pay for? I think mine was, and I don't do a lot of box blade work. The top cylinder is a must.

The drawback to higher HP is higher purchase price and higher fuel consumption. The latter is pretty much a non issue for hobbyists. At this point I wish I'd gotten the 4225 just for the extra power running the chipper. But most people don't chip 6-8" material. 37 hp is plenty for everything else I do. I can chip the big stuff with it, I just have to slow the chipper feed way down.

Branson's factory remote kit, when I bought my 3725 close to two years ago, was two valves. It's well integrated into a tight area of the tractor and was reasonably priced. The valves are not detent or float valves. I got a dealer installed third valve which is mounted on the fender. I should have gotten float or detent just in case. It usually does not cost much more to get a valve with one of those features vs a plain one.

Branson's factory 3rd function kit is a diverter, not a true third function. There are plusses and minuses to diverter vs third function. Either one works, it just depends on your preference. I'm told that the company that makes the 3rd function that Everything Attachments sells makes a kit for Branson. I think it's slightly cheaper than the Branson kit. The Branson one has a nice replacement joystick handle that has the same shape as the factory handle.

3rd function auxiliary hydraulic kits for all brands of tractors and loaders

Pugemasta · Dec 11, 2018

Hmm, will consider both grapples and forks. I can see uses for both, particularly grapples.

Sounds like top and tilt is a must.

I guess valves may not be an option at the dealer, I'll see if they're available on Friday. I think I understand the different options, just don't understand what I might use them for.

Will consider stepping down in hp when I price them out, but I think it might be worth the investment. I like the idea of a turbo, as found in the 5220, should give plenty of torque for the hills.

rScotty · Dec 12, 2018

I have some remaining Qs for you all, I'm just going to list all at once. Happy with whatever info you are able to offer:

1) which valves should I choose for remotes? Have tried to research some, but it's over my head still and don't want to make a mistake. I'll mostly be using grading implements. Maybe a PTO driven front or rear pull snowblower and who knows what else in the future. I believe the Branson 5220 is limited to three rear remotes and you can add a third function to the FEL.

Keep in mind that there are many ways to add remote hydraulics. Hydraulics may be over your head right now, but it is a simple subject and just one of many that is common rural knowledge. Welding is another. There are lots of sources to learn, and that is what rural living is all about....learning to do it yourself. There is even a rural living forum on TBN.
As for your concern about making mistakes, better get rid of that. It's an impediment to learning.

Factory original equipment added on by a dealer tends to get expensive and limited in number. The fact is that if all you are doing is actuating cylinders to go back and forth to adjust things, anyone can also plumb for as many remotes as you care to add by using universal spool valves and fittings from online hydraulic suppliers. It can be as easy as a rack of hydraulic valves plus tapping into an existing high pressure and return lines. Hydraulic hoses are usually made locally. Many rural towns have a hydraulic shop for hoses & advice. Hydraulics | www.surpluscenter.com

2) is a T&T kit needed for a box blade or LPGS? Thinking I may go with just the top link and hydraulic back blade to save money and complexity. Note that I'm planning on getting a backhoe attachment as well and I anticipate taking it on/off quite a bit.

Remember that almost every implement out there was originally designed to be adjusted manually. Hydraulic adjustment - like T&T - is nice and convenient, but certainly not a necessity.
You can do the same adjustments manually. It's really not much effort, and works just as well as hydraulic adjustment. Hydraulic adjustment makes more sense if you are doing this for a living, or are physically challenged, or lazy, or maybe just like to tinker. But if running your tractor is part of your rural living hobby, you can also do those adjustments manually. Doing things manually doesn't in any way keep you from adding T&T and other hydraulics later if you want. It's your hobby; make it fun.

3) weights: suitcase? Ballast box? Wheel weight's? Fill tires? You all have recommended filling the tires and getting a ballast box. Should I simply get as many suitcase and wheel weights as I can if I want stability and traction? Is weight good for the steep, 25%+ grade portions of the road? I know I want to add weight, could use some help on how much and where.

Some people like extra weight and others don't. I've tried all those types of weight and prefer the removeable kind like suitcase and wheel weights. Fluid in the tires is by far the cheapest option. Your first flat tire will show you the downside. The nicest setup are probably cast wheel weights - but unless you find some 2nd hand, they tend to be expensive.
Frankly, I wouldn't add weight until I found a need for it. There's simply no downside to waiting- you can add weight for the same effort anytime. And working on a slope is tricky enough to begin with. After you work for awhile you can deside on weights.

4) what backhoe bucket size? Pin on ok? Planning to build culverts and install septic w/ the backhoe initially. Soil is pretty soft, DG.

You size a bucket by the type of soil that you have. Too wide is better than too narrow. You want a bucket that makes a ditch wide enough to work in after the sides slump. Dirt tends to stick in narrow deep buckets - which is why that few are less than 12" wide.
It comes down to what percentage clay you have. 18" is a good universal size for a small hoe. 24" is good for larger ones.

5) hydraulic thumb worth the money? Looks pretty handy if one anticipates encountering large rocks.

Yes it is wonderful to have, but really expensive. Not just for large rocks, but for all kinds of picking and placing work. Think about building rock walls for instance.

6) pin on FEL bucket ok? I don't anticipate taking it off much.

This one is easy. Get the SSQA so you can then simply use all the skid steer attachments or optional bucket types in the world. None of the pin-ons is universal...ALL of the SSQA are.

7) I'm considering the Branson 5220h and maybe the MF 2706e. Am I buying too much HP? I don't think so due to the steep driveway and I want to be able to buy other attachments in the future that may or may not benefit from more PTO HP.

No comment on the brand of tractor that you choose. Everyone has their favorites. If it was me I wouldn't buy new my first time until I knew more about how tractors worked. You never have too much HP, just turn down the throttle. But buying HP is an expensive way to add weight.
I will say that the way you are approaching this project sounds like you are a fairly wealthy person, so your decision on what kind of tractor, size, and accessories to start with may not make much difference. As several people have said, the tractor you start with is almost never the one you end up with. But it's all about learning.

my motto: Good Luck beats Good Planning,
rScotty