Battery based electric vehicles of today and tomorrow.

[3930dave]

Regenerative braking is not available or reduced when the battery is close to 100% or if it's too cold.

Makes sense.

Might also be a High Temperature Limit on the pack (wrt. Regen Braking), but unless you are drag racing in Phoenix in July, you may not hit it...

Rgds, D.

 

[3930dave]

Bill Gates-backed ESS — which makes giant batteries out of iron, salt and water — starts trading

I expect with all the money being poured into renewables solutions by 2030 a lot of things will be solved.

In a change of events I noticed all countries around the world are calling for more coal production. Moving to renewable energy is fine but somebody didn't get the message that you need the replacement for your current energy sources before you change to a new one.

Recently read about the UK firing up just a bit more coal, as natgas has been spiking.

Other than hydro (one of the reasons I don't like seeing dams demolished), the problem with wind, solar, tidal, cow farts.... is they are transitory (fortunately on the last one !). Ergo, you need something to back up alt nrg.

While dumping costs on consumers and manufacturers seems de rigueur, some jurisdictions balk when it's their own skin in the game to keep the grid up.

Rgds, D.

 

[buckeyefarmer]

That's an east coast thing. In Wyoming, they removed entire mountains.

I live in the middle of coal country, never saw a mountain top removed. Strip mining only occurred where the coal seam was close to the surface. I’m sure there’s an instance somewhere, but in general, this is not true.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

I live in the middle of coal country, never saw a mountain top removed. Strip mining only occurred where the coal seam was close to the surface. I’m sure there’s an instance somewhere, but in general, this is not true.

It's more obvious from the air. Coal trains are miles long and the open pit mines are huge.

 

[airbiscuit]

 

[Citydude]

It's more obvious from the air. Coal trains are miles long and the open pit mines are huge.

You can learn a lot at 10,000 feet cant ya Bub.

 

[Grumpycat]

Regenerative braking is not available or reduced when the battery is close to 100% or if it's too cold.

Also not available at low speeds.

Prius regenerates when you lift the accelerator. Also when you apply the brakes. Light braking can be pure regeneration. Heavier braking mixes regeneration and friction. Quits trying to regenerate at 7 MPH when it seamlessly starts applying friction brakes. Oddly on dry roads you can not feel the transition with light braking, but you pay close attention you can when the roads are wet.

BMW i3 quits regeneration at 12 MPH, under which they reverse the drive to the motor to produce the single-pedal fiction of regeneration to a full stop. The BMW i3 owner's manual never uses the term "regeneration". Apparently not German enough for them. They say, "energy recovery".

Tesla lets you have whatever happens. The accelerator pedal only controls the motor. The brake pedal only controls friction brakes. You get some regenerative braking at low speeds but not much. Tesla doesn't try to fake it by reversing the drive motor the way BMW does.

 

[Grumpycat]

I live in the middle of coal country, never saw a mountain top removed. Strip mining only occurred where the coal seam was close to the surface. I’m sure there’s an instance somewhere, but in general, this is not true.

Locally we have what passes for a mountain (maybe 400'?) being dismantled the past 50 years for gravel.

 

[airbiscuit]

Does anyone seriously believe that mountaintop mining is a sound environmental practice? Tennessee Ernie Ford had it right.

 

[buckeyefarmer]

How about a higher view.
This area was all mined and reclaimed. You would never know it today that it was ever mined. All green, full of trees and fields.

 

[Citydude]

In the powder river basin, we turned useless sagebrush acres into grass lands for grazing after it was reclaimed.

People never see that part of mining.

 

[airbiscuit]

From West Virginia Public Broadcasting 9/17/2021
Legacy costs

Coal mining also has a number of legacy costs-- from abandoned mine lands to road damages from coal trucks.

A report from the Ohio River Institute says that Abandoned Mine Lands (AML) in West Virginia — these are coal mines abandoned before 1977 — account for just over 20 percent of the U.S. total and more than 24 percent of the costs.

Those mine lands account for 173,000 acres of land that need reclaimed with reclamation costs estimated at $5 billion. Only Pennsylvania has more unreclaimed pre-1977 mine lands than West Virginia. More than 30 percent of West Virginians live within a mile of an unreclaimed mine site.

......

In a seven-state area, there were 633,000 acres of land that needed some level of cleanup. More than 200,000 acres of that was in West Virginia — the highest total for a single state. Kentucky was slightly lower.

The total estimated outstanding cost of this reclamation ranges from $7.5 to $9.8 billion. The total available bonds amount to approximately $3.8 billion.

.......

West Virginia has approximately $3 billion of reclamation liability, from mines abandoned after 1977, but only has approximately $1.2 billion in bonds to secure that reclamation.

 

[SylvainG]

Also not available at low speeds.

Prius regenerates when you lift the accelerator. Also when you apply the brakes. Light braking can be pure regeneration. Heavier braking mixes regeneration and friction. Quits trying to regenerate at 7 MPH when it seamlessly starts applying friction brakes. Oddly on dry roads you can not feel the transition with light braking, but you pay close attention you can when the roads are wet.

BMW i3 quits regeneration at 12 MPH, under which they reverse the drive to the motor to produce the single-pedal fiction of regeneration to a full stop. The BMW i3 owner's manual never uses the term "regeneration". Apparently not German enough for them. They say, "energy recovery".

Tesla lets you have whatever happens. The accelerator pedal only controls the motor. The brake pedal only controls friction brakes. You get some regenerative braking at low speeds but not much. Tesla doesn't try to fake it by reversing the drive motor the way BMW does.

I'll need to check that next time I go for a drive. The 'energy' bar at the top will tell me if it's regenerating or not, unless they fake that.

 

[airbiscuit]

https://appvoices.org/end-mountaintop-removal/community/

"For more than a decade, Appalachia has also become known for the atrocity of mountaintop removal mining. The impacts on communities of blowing up mountains and dumping the rubble into streams are profound. It forces residents to contend with contaminated drinking water, increased flooding, dangerous coal slurry impoundments, and higher rates of cancer and other health issues.


Residents find little recourse due to weak regulations and government officials unwilling to stand up to coal companies. Communities near mountaintop removal sites are losing population as people move away in order to protect the health and safety of their families."

 

[Larry Caldwell]

You can learn a lot at 10,000 feet cant ya Bub.

I was more in mind of the Powder River Basin. Those are the coal trains that boggle the mind.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

In the powder river basin, we turned useless sagebrush acres into grass lands for grazing after it was reclaimed.

People never see that part of mining.

What do you do with the air? People never see that either.

 

[Grumpycat]

Does anyone seriously believe that mountaintop mining is a sound environmental practice? Tennessee Ernie Ford had it right.

What other purpose does the mountain serve?

 

[Grumpycat]

I'll need to check that next time I go for a drive. The 'energy' bar at the top will tell me if it's regenerating or not, unless they fake that.

Check what? The BMW i3 owner's manual states "energy recovery" ends at 12 MPH.

 

[SylvainG]

I mean the Tesla.

 

[Grumpycat]

I mean the Tesla.

You can feel the Tesla trying to regenerate/brake all the way to zero. It just doesn't reverse the motor the way the i3 does for more powerful low speed one-pedal deceleration. It can't make much power at low speeds because the rotor doesn't spin fast enough to produce enough voltage to feed the battery. But there is torque resistance when it tries.