Actual Tundra Towing Capacity

[familyman]

The small Toyota 4 cylinder trucks were well known for longevity. They do make a quality product, but it will take them some time to fine-tune it to our needs. There isn't a domestic truck out there, gas or diesel, that doesn't have issues. Also, look at the parts on a domestic - they're from everywhere but the USA.

 

[Toiyabe]

I'm not like most car drivers, so CR's data is not that relevant to me. Your milage may vary.

I buy stripped-down rigs with as few options as possible. Most people don't do that, and their experiance with fru-fru stuff breaking has a big influence on the reliability data of vehicles. I'm also very good at ignoring minor problems that most other people will get fixed.

What I care about is the powertrain compenents. I look for older, proven designs produced in large numbers so I can grab one out of the junkyard if I have to.

For most people, CR is probably great. It just doesn't fit my philosophy on cars.

My girlfriend's Toyota is falling apart. My Ford is holding up fine. That probably has something to do with the fact that we live 8 miles up a dirt road, and her Toyata is a car and my Ford is a truck. That's something that doesn't enter into CR's testing.

 

[patrick_g]

I don't buy stripped down models but not the fanciest either. In fact I don't buy new all the time.

New cars I have had in my lifetime:
'62 VW bug
'66 Sunbeam Tiger
'72 Rotary Mazda
'97 Ram 3500 diesel
'04 Toyota Prius
'08 F-250 diesel

I have had a total of 6 new vehicles and currently still have 3 of them. They all have had their strong and weak points.

I have bought a significant number of my repair parts from salvage yards but mostly NOT for the vehicles listed above.

What I read in CR about vehicle tests shows they do test and comment on controls and "the little things" but I will have to be shown where the radio knob layout and similar enters into their reliability stats.

What I see is good handling and look and feel issues as well as fit and finish. They don't just arbitrarily toss a dart at a list to decide what to report on. They try to report on what folks are interested in and sometimes on what folks should be interested in.They look at shilid safety restraint connections and other things which althogh of no use to me are important. They send questions out to subscribers and ask for their actual experience with carious aspects of cars and trucks. That is how they get experience data so they can recommend which used cars to avoid and which to buy. They reserve opinion when new models come out unlike the paid advertisement type articles in the trades.

If someone could site an actual example of where fluff unduly influenced a vehicle rating, I'd be happy to take a look at it but I can't find an example "in fact" although several folks seem to think it is a common happening. If it is so common as to derate the value of CR's auto info then it shouid be easy to cite several examples. Please stick to the last few years so I can have coverage in my back issues.

Pat

 

[Toiyabe]

Sorry, the knob thing was about Car and Driver, not Consumer Reports. I guess I didn't make that clear enough.

CR's reliability ratings are based on customer surveys. That's great. However it's aggregated across all versions of the model. For example, a vehicle may get a poor rating for electrical reliability. But is that applicable to someone who isn't getting power windows, mirrors, heated seats, sunroof etc.? Maybe, maybe not. Same goes for the tranny: Manual or Auto? Depends on how many of the respondents bought which option package.

Here's another issue: The clutch slave cylinder on my Ranger went bad, which appears to be a common problem (Mazda part, go figure). A friend and I replaced it in an evening, no big deal as far as I'm concerned. However, CR will report that as an unreliable tranny. There doesn't seem to be a way to sort out the important problems from the little problems that can be ignored or fixed by the shade-tree mechanic.

So again, I say if you are like most people and buy well-optioned vehicles, take it to the shop to fix everything that breaks, and use the rig the way that most other people do, CR is a good source of info. If you aren't like that it is a less good source of info.

 

[workinallthetime]

i think people tend to voice their opions on things more when they are unhappy with the product than when they are happy. When you find dealers giving away free fill ups, oil changes, 20 bucks, food coupons just to get you to send back a csi servey. but the people that are pissed cant wait to send it back. To me something like consumer reports is a place to go and figure out which one has the most problems.
Something else i think this thread is doing and that is taking decades of truck history from the big 3 and comparing it to a brand new truck that has no history in this weight class.
We can argue all we want about the toy and usa iron but in the end 10 years from now we will know the answer. True the big 3 buy parts from all over the world but at least the profits go to guys named bob and bill and fred and greg, not to yakomota and heroshki, sushi and you get the point.
im outta here

 

[charlz]

I have detected, over time, various negative comments regarding Consumers Reports in posts right here in River City, uh I mean TBN.

Consumer reports has been sued several times over their disseminated information about cars and trucks. Various of the manufacturers have sued them but CR has NEVER LOST A SUIT!!!

I have nothing against CR, in fact I have referenced them many times. Any research you can do prior to a major purchase is a huge plus in my mind.... but I also take everything with a grain of salt.

While 'CR has NEVER LOST A SUIT' they did come dang close with the Suzuki Samurai lawsuit... it was settled out of court.

Wonder why? They are unbiased reporters of the information they derive from their testing. Their testing is done based on rigorous scientific and engineering principles. You might not like what they report but it is extremely difficult to find factual logical cause to refute them.

If you review the court documents/evidence from the Samurai case you will see your statement above is hogwash. They devised special tests, replaced drivers, etc. to make the vehicle 'fail' the way they believed it should... after it performed flawlessly on the test track they had been using for all vehicles for almost 20 years.

Everyone is perfectly within their rights to disagree with CR over anything but you should ask yourself... is Johny in step and the rest of the army out of step?

Of course CR isn't perfect but if you find yourself disagreeing very much or very often with their test results which withstand scientific scrutiny then you have to ask yourself if you are open minded or if you only like sources that agree with you. Whether or not you are personally upset when the ox is gored seems to depend on whose ox it is.

Got to agree with you there.... waiting to hear what you have to say about the Samurai lawsuit and CR settling out of court

 

[Builder]

Also, look at the parts on a domestic - they're from everywhere but the USA.

What are you talking about?

I researched my domestic trucks and my GMC is 85% US made. My F-Series Ford Superduty is 84% US made and my IH dumptruck I've yet to see a foreign part on.

I mean, if you simply look at the major components on a Ford Superduty: IH engine-made in Indianapolis, IN, Ford Transmission made in Sharonville, OH(USA) Ford Sterling rear-made by Ford Visteon USA, Dana Front axle-made in USA, Ford body, made in USA.


Source: http://www.levelfieldinstitute.org/docs/lfi-domestic-content.pdf

I do not agree with your post at all.

 

[patrick_g]

Got to agree with you there....

Cut that out, that's no fun!!! Excuse me, I have other fires to try to put out with massive quantities of gasoine!

Actually there is no better way to find out what someone really thinks including their bias and such than to challenge them.

If we all just sit around in a circle and agree with each other about NAFTA, open borders, Iraq, the best truck, foreign content of American cars, foreign brands built in America (but maybe not in union shops) giving children fun rides in FEL buckets, using FEL as a high reach work platform, letting junior sit on the tractor fender, how anything more high tech than a tractor equivalent to a pair of mules is for sissies, use off road diesel on road because yo think the Gov charges too much tax, and on and on... life would be toooo boring.

Peace, dudes... chill...

Pat

 

[Builder]

Hi, JUst thought I would step in and stir the pot a bit to liven up the conversation. I like to try to put out fires by dousing them with gasoline!

I have detected, over time, various negative comments regarding Consumers Reports in posts right here in River City, uh I mean TBN.

Consumer reports has been sued several times over their disseminated information about cars and trucks. Various of the manufacturers have sued them but CR has NEVER LOST A SUIT!!!

Wonder why? They are unbiased reporters of the information they derive from their testing. Their testing is done based on rigorous scientific and engineering principles. You might not like what they report but it is extremely difficult to find factual logical cause to refute them.

Everyone is perfectly within their rights to disagree with CR over anything but you should ask yourself... is Johny in step and the rest of the army out of step?

Of course CR isn't perfect but if you find yourself disagreeing very much or very often with their test results which withstand scientific scrutiny then you have to ask yourself if you are open minded or if you only like sources that agree with you. Whether or not you are personally upset when the ox is gored seems to depend on whose ox it is.

OF course Motor Trend is a superior source of reliable and unbiased information. I once bought the Motor Trend Car of the Year. It was wonderful for about 50K miles when it did what virtually every single one of those puppies did, it totally died. Ran fine one day and couldn't be started no matter what the next day. I gave it to charity. Remember the rotary Maxda sedan?

To my wife and I and several of out friends Motor Trend recommendations are the KISS OF DEATH, a good reason to NOT BUY a truck or car.

Pat

The thing is, if you really use a truck for its' intended purpose, and not for picking the kids up after ballet practice, then the CR ratings on full-size trucks are relatively meaningless.

When will C/R throw a snowplow on the front of a full size and see who's truck plows the best? When will C/R hook up a dump trailer and see who's pulls 5 tons of topsoil the best?

Maybe they could put a utility body and a lumber rack on one and see who's handles a load like that? Maybe they could even be so gracious as to drive it across a muddy jobsite or a farm field to see who's handles it the best off road?

Maybe then they'd become more legitimate if they did that rather than testing the sun visors, cup holders and running it on the vaunted C/R wet slalom course to see whos' handles the best in case we ever get into a wet slalom racing contest in a full size work truck???

If they're gonna test, test like they get used in the real world, not like a soccer mom uses it.

 

[workinallthetime]

How many times do i have to say this?

A-MEN BROTHER L-39,LOL

I do read c/r, everytime i go get stiches or something for my allergies at the Dr.'s office, its much better reading than southern homes or betty crocker's cooking for the elderly,lol