HST vs. Shuttle shift

[scratchpad]

What exactly is the difference internally? I know the forward/reverse pedal for the HST and shuttle fwd/reverse is on the lever with a foot clutch. I tried doing a search but didnt come up with anything. Whats the advantages or disadvantages to either? Whether it be longevity or otherwise. Is it just a preferance of controls and the type of work one will be doing? I personally like a manual transmission but these others have me curious.

After starting this thread i scrolled down and saw "similar threads"

 

[mikester]

What exactly is the difference internally? I know the forward/reverse pedal for the HST and shuttle fwd/reverse is on the lever with a foot clutch. I tried doing a search but didnt come up with anything. Whats the advantages or disadvantages to either? Whether it be longevity or otherwise. Is it just a preferance of controls and the type of work one will be doing? I personally like a manual transmission but these others have me curious.

After starting this thread i scrolled down and saw "similar threads"

HST uses oil to drive the wheels. Think of an automatic transmission in a car. Usually one pedal to go forward, one for reverse. The harder you push it, the faster it goes.

Shuttle shift is a manual transmission with an added feature - an automatic clutch mechanism so you dont have to put the clutch in when changing directions. You control your speed with either a foot or hand throttle and gear selected.

It comes down to personal preference. Ive had both and now prefer the HST on my M59 because I get better fine tuning with infinitely variable speed control. Perfect for loader and finishing work. What I miss on the M59 is cruise control, so bush hogging was easier for straight aways on the shuttle shift, but HST is better when I need to change ground speed around obstacles without losing PTO RPM. I can do all my mowing in high gear and just adjust my ground speed with a touch of the pedal.

Smaller HST machines might have less power going to drive the wheels than SS, but On the M59 power delivery has never been an issue.

 

[scratchpad]

HST uses oil to drive the wheels. Think of an automatic transmission in a car. Usually one pedal to go forward, one for reverse. The harder you push it, the faster it goes.

Shuttle shift is a manual transmission with an added feature - an automatic clutch mechanism so you dont have to put the clutch in when changing directions. You control your speed with either a foot or hand throttle and gear selected.

It comes down to personal preference. Ive had both and now prefer the HST on my M59 because I get better fine tuning with infinitely variable speed control. Perfect for loader and finishing work. What I miss on the M59 is cruise control, so bush hogging was easier for straight aways on the shuttle shift, but HST is better when I need to change ground speed around obstacles without losing PTO RPM. I can do all my mowing in high gear and just adjust my ground speed with a touch of the pedal.

Smaller HST machines might have less power going to drive the wheels than SS, but On the M59 power delivery has never been an issue.

perfect, Thanks :thumbsup:

 

[Tx Jim]

perfect, Thanks :thumbsup:

mikester's reply was not exactly perfect. There are 2 types of shuttle shifts. Hyd type which he mentioned but there's also a synchronized type that one must depress traction clutch control pedal to shift from fwd to rev or vice-verse. I once owned a Kubota M4900 with sync-shuttle that required having the reverser replaced due to synchronizer failure & it locked in reverse.

 

[jeff9366]

MORE: tractor hst vs shuttle - Google Search

 

[DK35vince]

There are 2 types of shuttle shifts. Hyd type which he mentioned but there's also a synchronized type that one must depress traction clutch control pedal to shift from fwd to rev or vice-verse.

Correct.
I have a synchronized shuttle. It requires the clutch to forward/reverse.
Hydraulic shuttles, power reversers, glide shifts generally can forward/reverse without depressing the clutch.

 

[mike48130]

HST's do have cruise control. Depending on if you have electronic HST or older manual HST will depend on how it works. My JD with eHST has automotive style cruise control. It also has load match, so whn you are brush hogging or whatever, it will maintain RPM's and reduce speed to keep the power and speed to the PTO.

 

[LouNY]

There are many types of shuttle transmissions;
older style non-synchronized forward reverse lever style,
newer synchronized forward reverse lever style,
that lever can be down on the floor over on the side or under the steering wheel usually on the left side.

I have no knowledge of Glide shifts generally can forward/reverse without depressing the clutch.

Some power reversers will actuate a clutch.

Most power shuttles do not have a conventional clutch, they will have a forward and a reverse wet clutch packs that are electrically controlled.
If they have a clutch pedal it is usually a variable resistor, mounted to a regular looking pedal.

 

[Tx Jim]

There are many types of shuttle transmissions;
older style non-synchronized forward reverse lever style,
newer synchronized forward reverse lever style,
that lever can be down on the floor over on the side or under the steering wheel usually on the left side.

I have no knowledge of Glide shifts generally can forward/reverse without depressing the clutch.

Some power reversers will actuate a clutch.

Most power shuttles do not have a conventional clutch, they will have a forward and a reverse wet clutch packs that are electrically controlled.
If they have a clutch pedal it is usually a variable resistor, mounted to a regular looking pedal.

May I ask your definition of the word "MANY"?? Sounds to me that most type shuttle shifts have been covered in this thread. My Kubota M7040 hyd shuttle control has no electrical connections except for neutral start switch because it's cable controlled. I think clutch pedal is mechanically connected to hyd valve but Ill have to check tech manual to be sure. I also have no knowledge of Glide-shift.

 

[LouNY]

Some of the larger new tractors are computer controlled power shift with a shuttle command that will actually allow you to use different gears for the forward and reverse,
such as come into a load in 8th shift down to 3 to load reverse into say 10th to back out of your load area.

The older Puma 125 at the farm will allow you to set up different gears for forward and reverse, and if you use the foot pedal "clutch" and it doesn't like your selected gear it will use a lower one to get rolling then shift up to the one you had previously selected.

And we can't forget the IVT or CVT's with shuttles.

 

[MechanicalGuy]

My mx5200 hst has a mechanical lever cruise control.

 

[mikester]

HST's do have cruise control. Depending on if you have electronic HST or older manual HST will depend on how it works. My JD with eHST has automotive style cruise control. It also has load match, so whn you are brush hogging or whatever, it will maintain RPM's and reduce speed to keep the power and speed to the PTO.

The JD eHST is the nicest HST Ive ever operated, very smooth. Kubota puts cruise control on other HST models, just not the M59.

JD also gives the option for excellent seats and air ride. Kubota seat just suck.

 

[ovrszd]

As Lou has already pointed out,,,, there are many, many times more variations of Shuttle Shift than HST. Due to Lou's profession he is familiar with Shuttle variations that many of us have never heard of.

The grader I run is a variation similar to what he described with his larger tractors. Even has "anti-stall". You can't kill the engine by trying to force the shuttle to do something the engine can't handle.

These "smarter" Shuttle Shift systems also have gear speed spaced so close they almost duplicate HST and are much, much more efficient.

 

[Tx Jim]

As Lou has already pointed out,,,, there are many, many times more variations of Shuttle Shift than HST. Due to Lou's profession he is familiar with Shuttle variations that many of us have never heard of.

I must have overlooked the thread showing Lou's profession. I asked Lou to state how many different variations of shuttle shift he thought there was & now you state there are """many,many variations of shuttle shift""". Would you or Lou please state to this forum how many shuttle shift variations y'all are referring to in numbers?? It will surprise me if there's more than 10
Thanks,Jim

 

[ovrszd]

I'll give it a go.

Power shuttle are incorporated in transmissions in three forms: counter-shaft, full planetary (power shifts), and CVT transmissions. (3)

Mechanical shuttle are also incorporated in transmissions in three forms that I am aware of. Non Sychronized, Sychronized, and Dual Transmissions. (3)

The Kubota Glide shift is it's own creation and has features the above listed do not. (1)

The variations of Power Shuttle have their own secondary variations. Two that JD uses that I have ran operate completely different. I'm not sure what their specific title for each is.

One requires the shuttle lever to go thru neutral to change from F to R also requiring the gear selection to be shifted to neutral and then gated/clicked to whatever gear you choose. (1)

One simple rocks the shifter inward for F, outward for R not changing the selected gear in the process. The transmission is smart enough to select the necessary gear to implement the movement change then shift thru the gears to the previous selected speed. (1)

How'm I doin? Let's see, that's (9).

I'll do some Google searching and see how many more I can find. I haven't even touched the CVT designs.

 

[ovrszd]

Oh Jim, for comparison why don't you tell us how many variations of HST there are? Thanks.

 

[LouNY]

Well I guess that would depend on what variations you would wish to count,
it's about like how many heel styles are popular in the State of Texas, I'd say many how about you.
Also I would say ten was many or several.
I'd say that every manufacture currently in business has at least 2 variations how do you want to count them,
or make it simple and call it 3 mechanical, power, computer that better???
Realistically I'd say that there are 6-8 significantly different styles as long as you don't start counting construction types, is that """"many""""?????

 

[Tx Jim]

Oh Jim, for comparison why don't you tell us how many variations of HST there are? Thanks.

I don't have a clue nor really care to know how many type HST there are but the operation of a HST once one gets past the type of control is IMHO fairly similar. Best I remember from my dealer service manger days is HST has a piston pump with a swash plate to change hyd flow/speed hydraulically powering a piston motor.

 

[Tx Jim]

Well I guess that would depend on what variations you would wish to count,
it's about like how many heel styles are popular in the State of Texas, I'd say many how about you.
Also I would say ten was many or several.

Realistically I'd say that there are 6-8 significantly different styles as long as you don't start counting construction types, is that """"many""""?????

I fail to understand what the number of type of boot heels in Texas or any of the other 49 states has anything to do with number of types shuttle shift. And I think 10 or less different types of shuttle shifts is not very many. I hope you have a wonderful day,Jim

 

[ovrszd]

I actually forgot two. One of which I own. My TLB ises a Toque Converter with a hydraulic shuttle and a non sychronized 4 speed trans.

My Brother's TLB uses a Torque Converter with a Hydraulic Shuttle and a semi automatic 4 speed. No gear shift lever. Just twist the knob on the shuttle lever.