Massey Ferguson GC 2300 bent steering box brackets :(

[maheel]

Hi everyone

We have a GC2300 at our little pony club that has bent the steering box bent brackets that hold the hydraulic unit.

I removed them, flattened them and reinstalled but it has done it again after a few hours use and actually seems worse.

Can anyone explain why it might do this ? I thought if it's turned to full lock it might push on the bracket but an unsure and cant figure out why it has happened....

 

[irvingj]

Have heard of those loosening up, but not sure what could cause them to get bent. Got any pics? On level ground, does the tractor track straight with hands off the steering wheel?

 

[maheel]

 

[maheel]

Thanks for posting Irvingj i have been reading your posts

it looks a bit like its loose but it was bent both sides out about 10mm away from square.

it tracks or (or did) but the slop made me notice the issue in the steering its a shared tractor so not just one driver..... but i am now sort of in charge of looking after stuff

 

[maheel]

Here is a parts diagram, i also would have thought the tie rod end links would bend 1st if they had to if the ram just kept pushing. I will flatten again tomorrow but am trying to make sense of it 1st.

 

[hube2]

There was another topic I read recently, could have been an old one I found when doing research on steering ram locks. Someone else was having a similar issue. Actually I think it's come up several times. I can't find it now. From what I can remember there was some issue with early GCs and there was something about these being replaced. Maybe a maintenance bulletin or something like that. Also I remember something about them being installed backwards from the factor. I could be wrong, just going on what I remember reading about a week ago. Sorry I don't have more info for you other that this is a known issue on early GCs.

 

[JWR]

Looks like the only thing that holds that cylinder left-right is those two identical brackets. Have you seen the other one bent at all?
It looks like from the diagram that the only way this can happen is "too much steering force." I do not think the cylinder itself has the oomph to bend those brackets. Pretty well has to be excessive lateral force on the outer edge of the front wheels up at the level of the center of the hubs. How that happens = ?? One of you two operators is hitting something or moving with a lot of force against one or both front tires.

Any signs of impact or marks giving clues on the tires ? Rims ?

By the way, unless Massey redesigned the hardware showing in the post #5 diagram since the early GC's I don't see how it could have been an issue then and not now.

 

[hube2]

I can't say what has changed

The part# on mine is 6259310M2

The part# for the GC 2300 is 4265072M1 and is no longer available that I can find

I was just passing on something that I read in another topic. Like I said, I thought they may have said that there was either some kind of service bulletin or they were installed backwards or something like that. But then again how knows. Like I said I was doing research on steering ram locks and it was mentioned in something I read. For all I know it could be damage from getting banged, that boot on the tie rod end does not look to be in very good health.

I just looked at mine and I would also hazard a guess that front wheel alignment could play a part if it caused one wheel or both to put excessive inward pressure on the steering ram.

The back side of that bracket should be recessed so the that cylinder fits in and is held centered. If the cylinder came out of that recess it wouldn't take much jarring to bend the bracket. A slight bend is all it would take because the cylinder would not fit between the brackets if not seated in the recesses.

 

[maheel]

Thanks All

Just to clarify, both sides are bent "out" and yes i have seen the issue on another thread but not the solution or cause.

JWR - to much steering force may be it, say on near full lock and then wheels "pulling" or early lock is causing ''pushing" opposite on the ram bending the bracket.


Question / thoughts

If fulllock stops are "stopping to early" would the ram then push the opposite side bracket
eg: full lock left, cylinder pushes back on right hand bracket until ram stops pushing....

I have never adjusted these but it just crossed my mind....




Today i hope to
flatten them again (and order new ones). Thanks for current part number !!
reinstall and check full lock stops are correct
figure out whats going on....

 

[hube2]

Question / thoughts

If fulllock stops are "stopping to early" would the ram then push the opposite side bracket
eg: full lock left, cylinder pushes back on right hand bracket until ram stops pushing....

I have never adjusted these but it just crossed my mind....

I think I know what you are talking about. There is a bolt on each side of the axle. There is nothing in the owners manual about these bolts, what they are for or how they should be adjusted.

I had thought that these were there to keep the wheels from turning too far, that they are designed to hit the axle to prevent turning to far.

I just looked at mine and at full lock they are at least half an inch between them and the axle housing so they are apparently serving no visible purpose.

Mine have never been adjusted, I can tell by the paint on them.

But if your ram is at already at full lock and you hit a bump that puts inward pressure on the wheel then the only outcome that I can envision is that the entire steering piston would be pushed toward the other side of the tractor.

 

[hube2]

 

[maheel]

Yep, your thinking what i mean.

Its my next thing to check once i get it straightened out again.

If there is a small gap on the stop at full ram extension it cannot ''push" but would still act as a stop in if needed

tractor is not at my location so cant just walk and have a look

 

[hube2]

Logically, at least to me, these nuts should be adjusted to that there is only a few microns of space between them and the axle housing. They should not hit the housing when you turn because the constant banging would damage the housing, but they should be there to stop the wheels from turning farther than they are designed to.

This is important to me now that I see it because when I'm mowing I'm always turning corners as tightly as I can and the ground is not smooth.

I still cannot find any information on the proper adjustment of these bolts.

 

[JWR]

Certainly those bolts are intended to be stops. In absence of official directions for adjusting them, I would turn the steering gently to what looks sensible to you for "max left turn," back that bolt out to just touching & thus preventing further turning. Lock the lock nut. Repeat for the right side. At the extremes there should not be anything straining hard or binding and you should be enjoying the tightest turns feasible. Somewhere buried in a shop manual there is probably a specification on max turning angles, etc.

 

[irvingj]

Curiouser and curiouser.... After it gets light out (currently 4:23 AM here), I'll take a look at my 2310 and see if I might be able to shed any light on the issue. AFIK I've never had any steering issue with mine. Maheel, did you also happen to notice in your photo that the steering joint protective rubber boot is half gone?

 

[maheel]

Ok so i took the plates off, flattened them out again, put them back on.
At full lock, bolts on stops were touching and i reckon the ram was pushing on brackets.

I have backed off the stops to give me a small gap of 5mm and it does seem to have helped.

I ran out of time (and light) but will test drive tomorrow properly and see how it goes.
I am over in Australia so different timezone to many of you i think.

It would be good that any of you with the gc2300 let me know where your stops are etc on full lock if you could. I'll report back how it goes over here

PS - Yes the rubber boots are stuffed.... they are on the shopping list. Plates are $100 AUD a set here and need to price the boots.

few pics

 

[DMW]

A shot in the dark here with multiple users. Doubt its a mechanical issue, more likely a hydraulic one. Pressure is applied to the cylinder by an input from the steering wheel. Most operators will hold the wheel in position while turning, setting the angle of the front wheels and reducing the oil supply from the orbital valve. If the wheel is cranked over to one side and held so the hydraulics can be heard going over the relief valve, it might be a situation where the cylinder starts shifting. A little at first, then more and more. The steering in a car and the GC are quite different mechanical/hydraulic methods.

 

[hube2]

Why does my steering box keep breaking?

www.hoyetractor.com

Certainly those bolts are intended to be stops. In absence of official directions for adjusting them, I would turn the steering gently to what looks sensible to you for "max left turn," back that bolt out to just touching & thus preventing further turning. Lock the lock nut. Repeat for the right side. At the extremes there should not be anything straining hard or binding and you should be enjoying the tightest turns feasible. Somewhere buried in a shop manual there is probably a specification on max turning angles, etc.

That's pretty much what I'm finding for other types of tractors, nothing on these. My guess is that it's an adjustment overlooked by the dealer before delivery. What you suggest is pretty much what I'm planing to do on this weekend.

 

[Dmacleo]

There is nothing in the owners manual about these bolts, what they are for or how they should be adjusted.

service manual for gc2400 does not even show them on axle/spindle disassembly.
yet there are there.....

 

[maheel]

service manual for gc2400 does not even show them on axle/spindle disassembly.
yet there are there.....

Hi Dmacleo

When you have time can you put your 2400 on full lock and see if the stops touch for me please