Min tractor size for repairing long gravel driveway with potholes?

[dodge man]

The only problem with an older 2 wheel drive tractor is the often don’t have a loader. It would also be pretty hard on his yard for other uses.

 

[repete]

Before you do anything to maintain your driveway ($), address drainage. If you have a driveway with water up to the level of the road surface at times, you will never be happy.
It has been probably 20 years or more since I have used any sort of "digging" device on my driveway. Mostly because I know a few inches down is LARGE crushed rock for the base. Do not stir that base rock up or you will regret it.
I have only used a landscape rake on my driveway for years. Easy to pull gravel back across the road and maintain the "crown" which aids in drainage.

 

[JWR]

The only problem with an older 2 wheel drive tractor is the often don’t have a loader. It would also be pretty hard on his yard for other uses.

I agree with Dodge Man except to say that lacking a loader is NOT the only problem! In my opinion an old, large 2WD tractor is tons of trouble for you with little or no benefit. a) no loader b) you will regret lacking 4WD every day of ownership. A 2wd tractor is a stuck tractor at some point for no good reason. You will never regret getting a 4WD. c) No belly mower possibility d) lack of many attachments you may want in the future, on and on. From what you have told us and shown us a compact 4wd in the 24-40 hp range is most appropo.

Still have not heard how much you will be mowing, how big the overall property is, etc. Brush to cut or no ?

 

[wisconsitom]

I spread a lot of gravel with my 25-horse Bobcat with FEL. Fun! Mine has auto-float on that loader, which is intended to be used in reverse. It works great but I did have to learn how to maximize its capabilities. Basically, wherever the bucket sets down, a little divot will be formed. To avoid that, and get everything level and smooth, I found you want to begin reversing tractor before bucket edge hits ground. A running start and your good. 25 hp will easily get the job done, if it's anything like my machine. Some rear weight will be helpful. Something hanging off the back is best in this regard, but mine just has beet juice in the rears. I've had no troubles with lack of back-end weight.

 

[btarb24]

Thanks for all the great info and opinions on each side of the spectrum. It's great to hear it all to avoid overlooking a perspective.

In this case I wont actually use the tractor for any mowing/brushing whatsoever. We have about 2-3 acres of grass which i just cut with a zero turn. Then there's 40 acres of forest with trails behind the house. We haven't lived here more than a couple months, but i imagine after some years of 4 wheeler use we may end up with some rutting in the forest trails. I may want to take and plane down the trails to take out any severe ruts, so a smaller width tractor may be handy. For comparison, we scaled down our UTV and chose a mule SX since the width was only 52". I might have to make more haul trips due to the smaller bed, but we've got plenty of time on our hands

Similarly, with the snow and driveway maintenance I actually don't mind having the extra seat time associated with a smaller tractor and more passes. I work from home and so there's no urgency to clear the driveway before heading to work each day, etc. My biggest concern was that the scarifiers lowered or a full boxblade load wouldn't cause the tractor to bog down to a halt too frequently (occasionally is fine). A secondary concern is having enough traction in the winter to go back up the hill to return to the house, though that one seems like it'll work out alright as long as I throw some chains on loaded R4 tires?

I went and talked to a new holland salesman yesterday and he suggested a workmaster 25s would be an appropriate size. I asked why he wouldn't recommend the boomer 24 and he said he just didn't see me needing the extra size for just the driveway tasks. Without experience with the tasks at hand it sure is hard for me to feel assured it's what that perfect size is though! I think i'm going to shop in the 25hp sub to - 30hp compact range to find the best value. I may regret it, but I think i'd rather buy too small and possibly deal with some occasional frustration than buy too big just to be safe.

The used market is a bit tough at the moment but it's my preference to buy used if i can find one with a loader and front mount blower. However, used prices are super high right now and i do need something by the winter so i may just bite the bullet and buy new (something i rarely do with anything). Seems I have a nice selection of brands within the 20-40 mile range: Kioti, New Holland, LS, Deere, Yanmar, Kubota, Massey, Branson, Mahindra, TYM, McCormick, Zetor are what i was able to locate on google maps so far.

I would do my own repairs and maintenance so dealer service isn't too important to me. I think this makes premium brands like kubota and deere removed from the running if i'm buying new. Though, as a rookie it's seemingly rather tough to compare value across the brands.

 

[airbiscuit]

"I may regret it, but I think i'd rather buy too small and possibly deal with some occasional frustration than buy too big just to be safe."

More likely - famous last words - "I wish I bought a bigger tractor".

There is a big difference in the TRACTION between a Sub Compact Utility Tractor (SCUT) and a Compact Utility Tractor. A SCUT has the same size tires and wheels as a garden tractor. The larger wheels and tires on a CUT make a huge difference in traction, even if the horsepower is the same.

Don't get me wrong, a SCUT will do work and be fun, but you will end up spinning your wheels.

 

[the old grind]

Even a 4WD can benefit from tire chains when seasonally installed or left on year around say if a tractor rarely/never has to operate on pavement and isn't used for mowing. I agree that it's important to focus on more weight/hp vs more hp/weight or size, esp for moving snow.

 

[fried1765]

Thanks for all the great info and opinions on each side of the spectrum. It's great to hear it all to avoid overlooking a perspective.

In this case I wont actually use the tractor for any mowing/brushing whatsoever. We have about 2-3 acres of grass which i just cut with a zero turn. Then there's 40 acres of forest with trails behind the house. We haven't lived here more than a couple months, but i imagine after some years of 4 wheeler use we may end up with some rutting in the forest trails. I may want to take and plane down the trails to take out any severe ruts, so a smaller width tractor may be handy. For comparison, we scaled down our UTV and chose a mule SX since the width was only 52". I might have to make more haul trips due to the smaller bed, but we've got plenty of time on our hands

Similarly, with the snow and driveway maintenance I actually don't mind having the extra seat time associated with a smaller tractor and more passes. I work from home and so there's no urgency to clear the driveway before heading to work each day, etc. My biggest concern was that the scarifiers lowered or a full boxblade load wouldn't cause the tractor to bog down to a halt too frequently (occasionally is fine). A secondary concern is having enough traction in the winter to go back up the hill to return to the house, though that one seems like it'll work out alright as long as I throw some chains on loaded R4 tires?

I went and talked to a new holland salesman yesterday and he suggested a workmaster 25s would be an appropriate size. I asked why he wouldn't recommend the boomer 24 and he said he just didn't see me needing the extra size for just the driveway tasks. Without experience with the tasks at hand it sure is hard for me to feel assured it's what that perfect size is though! I think i'm going to shop in the 25hp sub to - 30hp compact range to find the best value. I may regret it, but I think i'd rather buy too small and possibly deal with some occasional frustration than buy too big just to be safe.

The used market is a bit tough at the moment but it's my preference to buy used if i can find one with a loader and front mount blower. However, used prices are super high right now and i do need something by the winter so i may just bite the bullet and buy new (something i rarely do with anything). Seems I have a nice selection of brands within the 20-40 mile range: Kioti, New Holland, LS, Deere, Yanmar, Kubota, Massey, Branson, Mahindra, TYM, McCormick, Zetor are what i was able to locate on google maps so far.

I would do my own repairs and maintenance so dealer service isn't too important to me. I think this makes premium brands like kubota and deere removed from the running if i'm buying new. Though, as a rookie it's seemingly rather tough to compare value across the brands.

As TBN member jeff9366 so eloquently states.......BUY ENOUGH TRACTOR !!!!

 

[JWR]

In Post #45 I'm glad you said you are a rookie. There are many people on here with more years serious farming and propertyy experience than myself but at 78 I've seen a lot of tractor work in youth (where we had almost no equipment) and then much more in my 20 years of retirement (where I loaded up with lots of equipment.) One thing I learned and you will learn is the profound long-term importance of finding a good dealer and having good relations with them.

With your listing of all the dealers and brands fairly close you have a good opportunity to shop 3 or 4 brands and find what you want as well as who the best dealers are.

Like fried1765 above, I say you are way better off with a little too much tractor than you are with not enough.
That short steep section of driveway should be easy to handle snow-wise by clearing your own path downhill first. If you have not played around in deep snow much with a tractor you may be surprised how easy it is to get hung once in a while. And clearance really matters. That's one more reason to get something larger than a glorified lawn tractor.

I tend to see the cost/price situation differently than you. I would not avoid Kubota or Deere new. I would stick to Kubota, Massey, Deere and New Holland in about that order if I were you. There is safety in numbers when it comes to parts, other knowledgeable people around, etc. You can probably find what you need in all of those brands so to me it comes down to reliability, comfort for you as user and access to parts and experience.

By the way, may have missed it but I've not heard you say if you lean toward a cab versus open station and a stick versus HST driveline.

 

[bcp]

No one has ever heard:

"I wish my tractor was smaller."

"I wish my loader was weaker."

"I wish my ground clearance was less."



Bruce

 

[IndyJay]

No one has ever heard:

"I wish my tractor was smaller."

"I wish my loader was weaker."

"I wish my ground clearance was less."



Bruce

add to that..

"I wish my ROPS was taller."

 

[btarb24]

I think i'll start with open cab. I have a leanto on the property that i want to park it under and it wouldn't fit with a cab on it. Figure I can always cobble something together later if i decide i need to defend myself from the snow. Parking and navigation between trees on the forest trails is what makes me gravitate more toward trying to buy the smallest tractor that's capable of the work i have. A larger tractor than i truly need would just mean wasted fuel, higher upfront cost, higher implement cost, and higher parts costs down the road. I'd rather spend an extra hour per project and possibly be a little frustrated than waste the money -- as long as the job gets done.

--

I'm still trying to sort it all out, but it seems that the tractor market is kind of similar to the power tool in that there are a handful of manufacturers that make several major brands.
LS makes models for -> New Holland, Case + 8 others
TYM makes models for -> Branson, RK, Mahindra, Zetor + 10 others
Yanmar makes models for -> Deere, Zen-Noh
Daedong makes models for -> New Holland, Bobcat, Cub Cadet + 5 others
Mitsubishi makes models for -> Case, Mahindra, Cub Cadet, IH+ 3 others

Tractors built by other manufacturers

tractors.fandom.com

Another way to look at it is New Holland buys and rebadges tractors from several other manufactures: Al-Ghazi, Buhler Versatile, Iseki, Landini, LS, Shanghai, Shibaura, Turk Traktor

List of tractors built by other companies - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Though, specs can certainly vary between what the manufacturer makes for themselves vs what they make for another company. For example, LS may make their own MT125 better or worse than how they make the NH Workmaster 25s. However, either way, if LS were to fail then you'd be out of luck with repairing a Workmaster tractor. Similarly, if Daedong were to go out of business then there would no longer be parts for the NH Boomer line. Kind of makes you have to think a bit about the perspective of which ones are the real 'off brands'.. is it New Holland, or is it LS/Daedong? Kind of like how some people are fan favorites of CubCadet and may say to avoid TroyBilts because they've had nothing but bad experiences with them.. yet they're both made by MTD. We all tend to develop or own brand favoritism, whether it is logical or not.

I'm mostly interested in looking beyond brand prestige/favoritism and simply finding the best value available. As i continue to research I'm finding that just about all of the major brands should hold up well over time and i feel I should be more concerned about features/capabilities than the sticker or paint colors. Getting the objective information about capabilities is a bit tricky though. Some people say you shouldn't bother clearing snow from a long driveway with anything less than 40HP and an 8 foot blade, yet others will use a walk behind blower because they're not worried about efficiency.

 

[airbiscuit]

Looks like you will be researching for a while. I'll make some popcorn

 

[bearthebruce]

I don't like beating a dead horse but wanted to comment on the tractor size. Original property was 47 acres wooded and a tractor came with it. It was equipped to do the the half mile driveway maintenance and the snow removal. 6' grader blade, no loader, 33HP Massey Ferguson.

We have yet to use it for the driveway. In part that is owing to our inexperience but also in part due to the tools not being quite what we think is needed. Angle a 6 foot grader blade to do gravel work and well, you have a bunch of passes to make.. an 8' blade would be better. But then that 8' blade might be a bit much for the 33 ponies..

We added more acres buying another 100 to add to the original 47... plus another property a quarter mile away with 60+ acres.. On several of the properties, we now have pastures to get under control and mowed. Added a 5' brush hog.. that takes all the 33 ponies can drag..

Added a front loader to help with stability on the hills with he brush hog on the back as well as move logs and stuff. Added pallet forks.

Now it feels like we need a bigger tractor. We're picking up downed trees to cut and move them. We are clearing trails and trying to grade these with a box blade, grader blade and a rake. For grading the implements need to be pretty heavy to get any work out of them. Our implements feel a bit light.

From what I have read of your plans, you need at least a machine the size of ours and given what I am telling you about where we are 4 years into this.. I think you will find on your 40 acres, you need a bigger machine than ours -'cause we feel we need a bigger machine and heavier implements.

I like the Massey.. it's a great machine. Our dealer is over an hour away... Not great but we manage. We can source the parts with them or others. We fix our own and like that our Massey is pre-crazy electronic age... Simple is good.

Not sure what we may do next... we just know we keep wanting to do new things on the property and keep having to think about whether or not the Massey can handle the chores we are thinking about doing. We may be over-thinkers being engineers.

If you go Sub-compact and want to build trails, I fear you will find yourself wanting a different machine soon. And where does that leave you? Selling the SCUT to buy the CUT you should have bought at the start?

Right now, we keep wondering if we should not have a 60hp or better machine because it would be heavy and it would not feel so tipsy on the hilly trails we are trying to cut. Sure we can add weights and such.. We are considering that. But as some have written, weight matters. I think your needs are more similar to ours than they are not...

@airbiscuit I hope my post allowed you 4 or 5 handfulls of that good popcorn!

 

[dodge man]

I have to add about JD and Yanmar. Yanmar no longer makes tractors for JD but does supply the engines on their smaller tractors.

 

[crashz]

I think you are going about shopping in the right order of size then brand. But do consider that you'll regret too small very quickly. And sitting on the computer thinking "I can just bundle up for the hour of plowing I need to do" is easy. When its raining and you need to clear a foot of snow off before it freezes is when you'll say "those guys were right about the cab!!"

Honestly - most folks here don't mind spending your money, but what they really want to do is help you make the best choice based on their experiences and failures. I wouldn't have said the comment above unless I got sick from plowing snow in the cold rain.

I would suggest this as well: Spend the premium for the Kubota or Deere in the size you choose. One for the availability of parts and two resale. You'll want that resale when you trade it in the for the bigger cab tractor!

 

[IndyJay]

"I'm mostly interested in looking beyond brand prestige/favoritism and simply finding the best value available."

You might want to look at Kioti then. I compared specs, looked at and drove Kubota, Massey, and Deere in the 35 to 60 HP range, several models of each. After reading reviews, I wound up buying a Kioti DK4510. Pretty much matched or exceeded specs for the L4701 and 1850M but was ~$10K cheaper than the others. I was able to load up options and still beat the base price of the others.

As far as dealers, the Deere dealer was closest, Massey the farthest, Kubota and Kioti were about the same distance in between the other two.

 

[airbiscuit]

Times 2 on Kioti

 

[RVL]

Too funny! I’m in the same area and actually looked at your house when it came on the market earlier this year! I’m certainly no expert, but I think the previous owner was on the right track with the NH they had sitting there. I took a look at one of my mapping apps because the place we ended up buying has ~500’ of driveway and I remember yours being a lot longer. I’m coming up with more like 1100’ feet of driveway for your place, which is quite a bit.

Whatever you end up doing, if you buy new definitely hit a few dealers. I was looking at NH and Kubota and was leaning toward a NH Workmaster 75 because the first Kubota dealer I spoke to just quoted me straight MSRP for everything and it would have been at least a 3-month wait for anything I ordered. Tried another Kubota dealer and ended up buying an M4 that was on the lot for close to $10K under MSRP.

 

[redman135]

1 point nobdy has made, as your experiance increases, you ALWAYS get mission creep.
2nd these little tractors are tippy. Look at adjuustable rear rims, spacers, or dual wheel options for when you do trail work.
Good Luck