New House Build in the Country!!!

[Billrog]

You certainly lucked out on finding a very good crew I was building most of my life & still wouldn't hesitate to have them build me a home.
As for sealing home to extent we do today it so you can size and properly control the air exchange in the home with minimum heat loss. I realize spray foam is a good insulator for sealing but fiberglass with 6 mil poly taped and acoustic sealer bottom plate and where vertical framing members meet eg. studs and cripples you'll have a well insulated home. It would be difficult justifying the extra cost of spray foams pay back $15,000 is a lot of money and take many years.

 

[Wakey]

I realize spray foam is a good insulator for sealing but fiberglass with 6 mil poly taped and acoustic sealer bottom plate and where vertical framing members meet eg. studs and cripples you'll have a well insulated home. It would be difficult justifying the extra cost of spray foams pay back $15,000 is a lot of money and take many years.

I'd really like to learn more regarding this. Outside of energy waste, I don't see the advantage of foam knowing it would take years to recover the cost. Factor that with solar becoming more affordable and it seems like a no brainier to do your best with yesterday's materials partnered with today's practices?

I checked on YouTube and found nothing but perhaps my search terms were incorrect.

 

[Kyle_in_Tex]

I'd really like to learn more regarding this. Outside of energy waste, I don't see the advantage of foam knowing it would take years to recover the cost. Factor that with solar becoming more affordable and it seems like a no brainier to do your best with yesterday's materials partnered with today's practices?

I checked on YouTube and found nothing but perhaps my search terms were incorrect.

I don't know if you are thinking like me, But if you designed the roof for solar panels, wouldn't they act as super premium radiant barriers in the summer, while they provide shade and electricity??? 15K would be a great start to a solar system.

And I'm not even a tree hugger. I guess I just look at it as which way you would spend your 15K if you had it...

 

[Billrog]

Wakey this should answer a few guest ions for you.
https://hpo.bc.ca/sites/www.hpo.bc.... Practices for Insulation and Air-Sealing.pdf

 

[Wakey]

Kyle, I'm with you and Billrog, THANK YOU!!

 

[jk96]

I'd really like to learn more regarding this. Outside of energy waste, I don't see the advantage of foam knowing it would take years to recover the cost. Factor that with solar becoming more affordable and it seems like a no brainier to do your best with yesterday's materials partnered with today's practices?

I checked on YouTube and found nothing but perhaps my search terms were incorrect.

I'll chime in on why we did foam. It made sense for us but may not for everyone. Our main reason was energy waste. On a smaller home the savings may not be there however we have about 3900 sq/ft of conditioned space 1st and 2nd floor and another 900 in the basement that is heated occasionally. On top of that the house is mostly open to the roof line with very little attic space. Here's a pic of the great room to give you an idea.


I figure my cost to have someone batt and blow insulation would have been about $6000. Closed cell spray foam for the entire home, 3-1/2" in walls, 5-1/2" in roof, and 2" on basement walls was $22,500. Extra expense for foam = $16,500. I'm 38 years old and hope to live in the house for another 30-40 years if I'm lucky. Now let's look at some numbers. If I figure a 15 year payback I would have to save $1,100 per year in heating/cooling. Based on my usage I figure I'm probably saving more than that and am closer to a 9-10 yr payback. Anything after that is savings each and every month. For this winter heating season from Nov 1st to Feb 29th I it cost me $590 to heat our home for the season using a geothermal heat pump. I know others who have similar sized homes with batt insulation and are paying $400 per month for heat with equally high bills in the peak cooling season. On days when the temps reach 50 degrees and sunny we can turn the heat off until sundown. We could have also made up some of the extra expense with a smaller sized HVAC system if our contractor had sized ours correctly but that's a whole different story.

A few other things that come to mind. Extremely quite house. Even temperature throughout. Very low airflow needed to heat and cool equals an HVAC system that you never hear or know when its on or off. In regards to solar we looked at it and looked again last year. Unless you can get some very good subsidies in addition to the federal tax credit and DIY the system install the payback is still not there.

Edit: I am located in NW Missouri - Electric Rate .13 Kwh

 

[Wakey]

JK, beautiful home! If I had the money for foam and Geo I'd do it but with my budget I might get solar for an offset. 15 years from now when I would reach zero with foam, solar will be even more efficient and I could upgrade.

I like the lack of waste and quiet but we all have different check books.

 

[buckeyefarmer]

JK's house is a work of art. If you haven't seen it, check out his build tread.

 

[jk96]

I understand Wakey. Every build is a trade off between wants, needs, and budget. My reason for posting was in reply to your question about why anyone would spend so much extra for foam. For us the it made sense as I felt the payback was there and in a reasonable time period. When we built our previous house 15 years ago there's no way we could have sprung for extras such as foam or geo even if it paid in the long run. We had a metal building for the business we were starting and built the house inside the building on an upper level. I promised my wife at the time we would build a regular home in the future when our checkbook was in better shape.

Justin the house is looking great. I'm late to this thread so I'm sorry if it's already been mentioned but after your mechanicals have gone in and before sheetrock use a good quality camera, high megapixal so you can get pictures of full walls and still zoom in for smaller details. Move room to room taking pictures of everything. Walls, ceilings, plumbing, wiriring, hvac ducts, etc. I've already gone back to my pics a couple of times and is really nice to be able to pull up a wall section if needed and see exactly where something is at.

 

[Kyle_in_Tex]

I'll chime in on why we did foam. It made sense for us but may not for everyone. Our main reason was energy waste. On a smaller home the savings may not be there however we have about 3900 sq/ft of conditioned space 1st and 2nd floor and another 900 in the basement that is heated occasionally. On top of that the house is mostly open to the roof line with very little attic space. Here's a pic of the great room to give you an idea.
View attachment 459657

I figure my cost to have someone batt and blow insulation would have been about $6000. Closed cell spray foam for the entire home, 3-1/2" in walls, 5-1/2" in roof, and 2" on basement walls was $22,500. Extra expense for foam = $16,500. I'm 38 years old and hope to live in the house for another 30-40 years if I'm lucky. Now let's look at some numbers. If I figure a 15 year payback I would have to save $1,100 per year in heating/cooling. Based on my usage I figure I'm probably saving more than that and am closer to a 9-10 yr payback. Anything after that is savings each and every month. For this winter heating season from Nov 1st to Feb 29th I it cost me $590 to heat our home for the season using a geothermal heat pump. I know others who have similar sized homes with batt insulation and are paying $400 per month for heat with equally high bills in the peak cooling season. On days when the temps reach 50 degrees and sunny we can turn the heat off until sundown. We could have also made up some of the extra expense with a smaller sized HVAC system if our contractor had sized ours correctly but that's a whole different story.

A few other things that come to mind. Extremely quite house. Even temperature throughout. Very low airflow needed to heat and cool equals an HVAC system that you never hear or know when its on or off. In regards to solar we looked at it and looked again last year. Unless you can get some very good subsidies in addition to the federal tax credit and DIY the system install the payback is still not there.

Edit: I am located in NW Missouri - Electric Rate .13 Kwh

I can certainly agree with your numbers. There are many reasons that closed cell is the best. I have lived in a house with a quiet HVAC system, and I miss it, but I am used to what we have now.

My question is more aimed at those of us who live in the deep south with months of 100F temps some years, as opposed to having to fight off the winter chill for many months. So with having to run the AC 6-9 months of the year, I was just wondering if the solar panels and the radiant barrier shade they provide would be better down here.

 

[EddieWalker]

Construction Details - CertainTeed

This is a link that shows several ways to properly install flashing to a wall. I do not see this in your pictures. You might also google "roof to wall flashing" and click on the images link. There are a lot of pictures showing how it should be done.

 

[jk96]

I can certainly agree with your numbers. There are many reasons that closed cell is the best. I have lived in a house with a quiet HVAC system, and I miss it, but I am used to what we have now.

My question is more aimed at those of us who live in the deep south with months of 100F temps some years, as opposed to having to fight off the winter chill for many months. So with having to run the AC 6-9 months of the year, I was just wondering if the solar panels and the radiant barrier shade they provide would be better down here.

Kyle I just don't see the pay back when you run the numbers without additional subsidies on top of the federal tax credit. Im not against solar. I have 50kw system on our building. Our utility had a $1.50 per watt rebate at the time. Without it the numbers didn't work.

In fact I just ran numbers for a friend last week who was looking at an 18kw system for his home. Grid tied, professional install. Only subsidies available are the fed tax credit. Payback was about 22 years. If you have additional subsidies available from state or utilities it can be a very good investment.

 

[mikefromnh]

Construction Details - CertainTeed

This is a link that shows several ways to properly install flashing to a wall. I do not see this in your pictures. You might also google "roof to wall flashing" and click on the images link. There are a lot of pictures showing how it should be done.

It looks to me like they used black step flashing. To paraphrase Aaron Rodgers, r-e-l-a-x

 

[EddieWalker]

It looks to me like they used black step flashing. To paraphrase Aaron Rodgers, r-e-l-a-x

I've always found that relaxing wears me out. So, no thank you.

Did you look at the pictures?

And did you look at my link that shows numerous examples of how it should be done?

I realize that I'm pointing out negative things in this build and a lot of you prefer to be cheerleaders, which I'm sure is very nice for the guy having his house built. But do you honestly want your house framed to old standards, things that are not done anymore? When somebody says that's how we always do it, I cringe. Continuing to do something the same way when better materials and techniques are out there goes beyond my comprehension. Supporting it is worse the putting your head in the sand.

Overall I give this framing crew a C grade. They seem to be fast and efficient. They have done this A LOT. No denying it. But my guess is that they learned their trade doing track houses and not custom homes. They are paid by how fast they get it done, not how well it could be done.

I have no doubt that the house will be nice when it's done and if any issues show up, they will be minor for the next ten years or even 20 years. The issues I'm seeing are what I repair in older homes. Things that take decades to happen. This is why those practices are not used any more. Nothing is 100%, so saying that's how my house is, or that's how they always did it might be fine for a few houses. Why gamble? Some people who smoke never get cancer. Is that a reason to keep smoking?

I personally post stuff on here so somebody will tell me what I'm doing wrong, or to tell me that there are better ways to do it. I'm currently redoing the siding on my house because I chose a Hardie product that I do not like anymore, and that has since changed how it should be installed. I still like Hardie, but I will never use their 4x8 sheets for siding ever again. I ignored the advice I received not to use it, and now I'm paying for that stubbornness.

 

[justinramani]

I appreciate everyones input equally the good, the bad, and the ugly. To be fair - we are basically paying slightly over tract home pricing for a house that we were able to customize and build the way we wanted. We are happy with how things are progressing. Did we get the absolute best materials???? It's probably safe to say that the answer is no. On the other hand, if we had demanded nothing but the best, we would not have been able to afford the house we wanted. Is there a trade off - sure there is.....

 

[mikefromnh]

I've always found that relaxing wears me out. So, no thank you.

Did you look at the pictures? View attachment 460470

And did you look at my link that shows numerous examples of how it should be done?

I realize that I'm pointing out negative things in this build and a lot of you prefer to be cheerleaders, which I'm sure is very nice for the guy having his house built. But do you honestly want your house framed to old standards, things that are not done anymore? When somebody says that's how we always do it, I cringe. Continuing to do something the same way when better materials and techniques are out there goes beyond my comprehension. Supporting it is worse the putting your head in the sand.

Overall I give this framing crew a C grade. They seem to be fast and efficient. They have done this A LOT. No denying it. But my guess is that they learned their trade doing track houses and not custom homes. They are paid by how fast they get it done, not how well it could be done.

I have no doubt that the house will be nice when it's done and if any issues show up, they will be minor for the next ten years or even 20 years. The issues I'm seeing are what I repair in older homes. Things that take decades to happen. This is why those practices are not used any more. Nothing is 100%, so saying that's how my house is, or that's how they always did it might be fine for a few houses. Why gamble? Some people who smoke never get cancer. Is that a reason to keep smoking?

I personally post stuff on here so somebody will tell me what I'm doing wrong, or to tell me that there are better ways to do it. I'm currently redoing the siding on my house because I chose a Hardie product that I do not like anymore, and that has since changed how it should be installed. I still like Hardie, but I will never use their 4x8 sheets for siding ever again. I ignored the advice I received not to use it, and now I'm paying for that stubbornness.

I did see the properly installed step flashing going up the sidewall. I'm not sure what your link on built up roofing membranes has to do with it though? They are obviously not finished but I'd be willing to bet they plan to flash under the window before they are done, heck if they want to get fancy they might even build a sill pan out of ice and water shield to tie all together.

 

[EddieWalker]

I did see the properly installed step flashing going up the sidewall. I'm not sure what your link on built up roofing membranes has to do with it though? They are obviously not finished but I'd be willing to bet they plan to flash under the window before they are done, heck if they want to get fancy they might even build a sill pan out of ice and water shield to tie all together.

How would you go about installing the lower flashing AFTER already installing the side flashing?

 

[mikefromnh]

I appreciate everyones input equally the good, the bad, and the ugly. To be fair - we are basically paying slightly over tract home pricing for a house that we were able to customize and build the way we wanted. We are happy with how things are progressing. Did we get the absolute best materials???? It's probably safe to say that the answer is no. On the other hand, if we had demanded nothing but the best, we would not have been able to afford the house we wanted. Is there a trade off - sure there is.....

One cheap thing you can now regarding air sealing is to make sure every hole and penetration through the building envelope is sealed properly. Your builder may or may not take this seriously. Cheap to do now almost impossible to do later.

Get some cans of spray foam and caulking and seal around every hole that is drilled before they insulate. Pay special attention to all the holes drilled into the attic area. Plumbers and electricians leave lots of air leaks when they do their rough in.

Check with your builder before doing anything thoug; your inspector might want you to use fire rated foam and caulking in certain areas.

 

[justinramani]

One cheap thing you can now regarding air sealing is to make sure every hole and penetration through the building envelope is sealed properly. Your builder may or may not take this seriously. Cheap to do now almost impossible to do later.

Get some cans of spray foam and caulking and seal around every hole that is drilled before they insulate. Pay special attention to all the holes drilled into the attic area. Plumbers and electricians leave lots of air leaks when they do their rough in.

Check with your builder before doing anything thoug; your inspector might want you to use fire rated foam and caulking in certain areas.

What kind of caulk should I use?

 

[mikefromnh]

What kind of caulk should I use?

I like DAP ALEX. Cheap, flexible and easy to smear into any cracks and crevices.