Offset Flail Ditch Bank Mower

[TerryR]

I did today talk to Iowa Farm Equipment, and as powerscol said, they were helpful. At least I think so, but now I'm re-thinking my near-decision.

I had been thinking of the offset flail as a ditch and edging mower, intending to continue to use my 5' Bushhog rotary cutter as my main mower. But IFE pushed me to think of it as a replacement for the Bushhog. That means re-thinking which one I want.

I've been looking at some 47" models, but leaning towards the Del Morino 52". It's their lighter duty line which is attractive because I'm thinking I'm pushing it on our hilly property with my JD 870. It's rated at 28hp and weights 2600 lb. plus 500 lb. or so from the loaded tires.

IFE says I can successfully run their 60" Fox Cross, which weighs 640 lb. I'm not sure about that.

But if I could that would let me abandon the 20-year old Bushhog, solving a storage issue and eliminating the need to change mowers when mowing. I know you flail fans would go for that. But do I have enough tractor to pull that off?

If it helps, here are a couple of photos of the property: The View - Part 2

My iPhone says some of that is 20 degress or steeper, which is 36% grade.

 

[leonz]

If you going to mow the side hill with it your going to want to invest in a tilt meter or just plan on mowing up and down and having suitcase weights and set of dual tires(if useable) and a front suitcase weight frame available for it.

 

[TerryR]

I mow the steep parts up and down now (except for bottom edge where I have turn around), and use suitcase weights.

How would a tilt meter help?

Is a flail more hazardous on a side hill than a rotary cutter? I've seen dire warnings about them on side hills.

 

[RoyJackson]

I mow the steep parts up and down now (except for bottom edge where I have turn around), and use suitcase weights.

How would a tilt meter help?

Is a flail more hazardous on a side hill than a rotary cutter? I've seen dire warnings about them on side hills.

I'd be more concerned with a rotary cutter, if mowing across the slope. The tail wheel can pivot and the cutter may pull the tractor with it. I've experienced this, but it wasn't a steep slope. The tractor was a Deere 790 (about 2200-2300 lbs. when the loader was removed (had 4 42 lb. suitcase weight on front to counter the cutter's weight), the cutter was a 5' Land Pride medium duty...I think it weighed a bit under 600 lbs. which was about 26% of the tractor's weight.

 

[TerryR]

I just placed an order with Iowa Farm Equipment for a Peruzzo Fox Cross 1600 - 60" cut.

I decided on a 60" model because I expect I'll find I will use it for all my mowing, replacing my 60" Bushhog rotary cutter, and I think that's the biggest my tractor will handle.

I decided on the Fox Cross in part because it's relatively light for a 60" which I think is wise for my situation. More importantly, best I can decipher the specs, it has more offset than the others in it's class. It reaches 53" past my wide-set tires (a bit more if I pull the 3-point hitch to the side as I've always done for my rotary cutter). And it reaches around 27" from the center line of the tractor to the inside cutting edge, so it will work better over the side of banks.

Thanks, I think, Roy, for bringing up this topic. At least my wife won't have to go Christmas shopping for me.

Thanks also to powerscol for all the helpful advice.

 

[poncho62]

I also have an embankment on my property. Trouble is, it goes up to the road with a guard rail at the top......I am also a cheap SOB, so this is my solution...it also will go down into the ditches etc.

 

[leonz]

I mow the steep parts up and down now (except for bottom edge where I have turn around), and use suitcase weights.

How would a tilt meter help?

Is a flail more hazardous on a side hill than a rotary cutter? I've seen dire warnings about them on side hills.

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The tilt meter was designed and based on the design of the protractor to measure angles and mounted on the hood of the mule shows the operator the exactly what the angle is that the tractor is operating on as the hood of the mule is positioned at the same angle that the front and rear axles are resting as they move provided the hood is not damaged and unhinged of course.

The tilt meter also has the danger area/angle for a roll over to occur outlined in red(if I remember correctly) on both sides of the protractor in relation to the actual zero angle of the protractor that the tilt meter is based upon. The general rule was 15 degrees maximum angle of slope for safe operation of a riding lawn mower mowing across the slope in this example.

A larger mule will have the effects of gravity and the angle of tilt compounded higher as it is taller than a riding lawn mower or garden tractor and the angle can become greater simply due to the tire size of the mule.


Any side hill is dangerous to operate on unless you have a side hill tractor,combine etc.
Do you remember where you read that about using a flail mower on side hills? The thing is that the entire mower stays on the ground riding on the rear roller and it is not more dangerous to use simply because any and all of the mowed brush/grass passes over the flail mower rotor and then falls to the ground.

If you turn a rotary cutter or for that matter any long implement on a slope it may end up lifting in many cases simply due to the length of the of the implement and the laws of physics affecting the overhanging implement.

The flail mower is not dangerous in using it on a side hill of 15 degrees as the mowers geometry is smaller in length and it is less effected by a turn and will weigh more in most cases and will have much less of a tendency to lift up as long as the tractor is operated properly AND SLOWLY in making turns if the operator intends to mow on the side hill. I always mowed up and down with ours anyway as it was heavy and a towed motorized unit.

Ideally you want to mow up hill in reverse and then down hill anyway with a steeper slope to overcome the potential for the potential of a side hill roll over accident.


Going from memory here:
The only way to overcome the problems with a mule with a higher center of gravity is to purchase smaller rims and tires if available to reduce the height of the center of gravity which is the rear axles center line height from side to side through the axle shafts.


Adding:
A low profile orchard and vineyard mule is perfect for mowing in many conditions and slope angles due to the nature of vineyards and orchards which are on slopes in many cases.

Going a bit slower is always a good idea in slope mowing anyway as the side hill maybe damp and the mule can slide sideways and scare the operator while working possibly causing the operator to overcompensate when controlling the mule while working.


Do not worry Terry you can mow safely with the flail mower and your rotary cutter will be so disgusted it may try to hit the flail mower with stones and by then you can sell it and have more room to store things.


Please let us know when you have received the the flail mower and then I can officially welcome you as the newest lifetime member of the Flail Mower Nations from the Great State of North Carolina.

 

[Fallon]

I've mowed some ditches with my old L3200 & 719 flail that were so steep the high side tire lost traction. I was just inching along in the ditch with the offset on the uphill side. I left it in 2wd to give me an earlier warning on problems. When the high side tire would start spinning I knew it was to steep to continue. I'd back out using 4wd if necessary & avoid that section of ditch until it got less steep.

 

[TerryR]

The tilt meter was designed and based on the design of the protractor to measure angles and mounted on the hood of the mule shows the operator the exactly what the angle is that the tractor is operating on as the hood of the mule is positioned at the same angle that the front and rear axles are resting as they move provided the hood is not damaged and unhinged of course.

The tilt meter also has the danger area/angle for a roll over to occur outlined in red(if I remember correctly) on both sides of the protractor in relation to the actual zero angle of the protractor that the tilt meter is based upon.

I understand how a tilt meter works. My question is how does it help? Certainly red lines drawn by a manufacturer with no idea what my tractor is and how it's configured are worthless. How do I know what the real limits are? And how is tilt meter better than measuring the slope directly? I know my steepest areas are 22 degrees already.

The general rule was 15 degrees maximum angle of slope for safe operation of a riding lawn mower mowing across the slope in this example.

Interesting theory, but around here we consider 15 degrees "level." I've been mowing this field for 20 years with a rotary cutter. I mow the part below the fence sideways because there's not other way to do it. It's 20 degrees. I know that at a rather flat 12 degrees my tractor crabs enough that I have to run the front tire at least a foot up the hill to keep the mower from leaving an un-mowed strip.

My question was how will changing to a flail change anything? Why do I suddenly need to buy a tilt meter and dual wheels, and change my mowing pattern?

If you turn a rotary cutter or for that matter any long implement on a slope it may end up lifting in many cases simply due to the length of the of the implement and the laws of physics affecting the overhanging implement.

No, a long implement is more stable if anything. It's not overhanging. It's riding on its own wheel. Why on earth would it lift?

The only way to overcome the problems with a mule with a higher center of gravity is to purchase smaller rims and tires if available to reduce the height of the center of gravity which is the rear axles center line height from side to side through the axle shafts.

Actually, the usual way is to set the rear tires out wider and load them or add wheel weights.

Do not worry Terry you can mow safely with the flail mower ...

That's not what you've been saying. You've been saying I have to make all sorts of changes to make it as safe as the rotary cutter I've been using for 20 years.

 

[RoyJackson]

I understand how a tilt meter works. My question is how does it help? Certainly red lines drawn by a manufacturer with no idea what my tractor is and how it's configured are worthless. How do I know what the real limits are? And how is tilt meter better than measuring the slope directly? I know my steepest areas are 22 degrees already.

You have to determine what you and your 870's capabilities are. The tilt meter just gives you an indication how close you're coming to those capabilities.
As at least one poster wrote...15 degrees is what the manufacturer (of the tilt meter) has determined to be the beginning of the danger zone for a typical tractor. There are studies, by both tractor manufacturers and, IIRC, some agricultural institutions; of tractor slope capabilities. Obviously, not every iteration can or will be checked...so, it's a guide.
As I'd written in the beginning, you (and any other tractor operator) have to determine yours and your tractor's capabilities...hopefully without rolling over!