Question on JCB swing cylinders

[Richard]

Ok, so the buggers are off.

Put 4 straps around them....2 in front....2 in rear.... used the straps to sort of 'ratchet' them down, one at a time.

Found out that with the ram in the hoe socket (even if not pinned) that helped act like a lock with the trunnion in place. Had to do some twisting & turning to get them out. I think it will be much easier to put them back up collapsed and then used the hydraulics to align with the pins (after they're fully mounted)

Here's some pictures of how I took them down (alone, without any help I might add)

Right now, I'm looking to try to do the same thing in reverse when I put them back.

 

[Richard]

Ohhh... I meant to add... there are the four bolts that hold the bottom plate in place. I'm sure I could reuse three of them with zero issues. I "think" I could use the fourth but truth be told.... it was a bugger to get out. I'm guessing there was some crossed threads in there but they were minor. My impact wrench was able to handle three of the four (it's pretty heavy duty).

I had to use the pipe wrench with cheater bar to take the last nut 90% off, then the impact would get it.

I might replace all four of them just to have peace of mind.

 

[BukitCase]

Well, I don't see any extra body parts in the pix so I'd say it went OK

Also didn't see a board for the jack to roll on, or is it just not in the pic?

Those 4 bolts are technically called studs - as in, no head, threads on both ends - a LOT of those have different threads on one end than the other - typically coarse on one end and fine on the other. IF you can find direct replacements, I would also replace them all, and if the new ones have more than 1 thread protruding past the nut I would still double nut them.

No way would I re-assemble that part without anti-seize on the outer threads, and at least loctite blue on the ends of the studs that go into the main frame. Best way to re-install studs is to double nut the end that's NOT screwed into the plate, lock the nuts together HARD, then use a wrench on the OUTER nut to run the stud into its socket tightly. (It helps if you have a bottoming tap of the right size to clean out the holes first.)
Then you can hold the inner nut with one wrench and back out the outer one first, repeat all that til all 4 are back in place.

Hopefully all I saw on the surfaces of the rods was removable crud, and NOT rust pits - ANYTHING but smooth chrome on those rods and you'll soon be REALLY well-versed on this job - because your brand new gland seals will last maybe 8-10 hours of use and start leaking again, especially if any roughness PROTRUDES from the smooth surface.

If you're good on that condition, great - otherwise you may wanna ask your hydraulic shop about rechroming.

Getting there - if your wife is as addicted to what these beasts can do as much as MINE is, she'll nag you to get it back together ... Steve

 

[Richard]

Actually, those 4 are indeed bolts. Though I didn't measure, they're about 12/14" long and about an inch in thickness. (though I'm sure they are in MM's)

In the first picture above, you can actually see where I raised the bolt to get it out of the way from the cylinders under it. I didn't want to hit it and bugger a cylinder or the threads. I was thinking the two were bolts and the rear two are studs.... until I tapped on them and got one of the rears to raise up a bit (lots of dried mud holding it in)

I have one of the bolts in my trunk and will find out about replacing them tomorrow. Also have the lower trunnion "cap" (or whatever it's called) in the trunk. Going to see if the dealer can tack weld one of those caps on for me. I noticed that the side with the cap had held some grease in it while the other one.....

I'm certainly no expert in grading rod chrome.... that said.... all the rods on this machine look to be in good condition. I always try to park it with as many of them covered (retracted) as I can. If the issues are on the microscopic side then it could be toast for all I know.

I'll ask the shop tomorrow for their opinion. I guess they'll know way more about that than me. (ha)

You're right about the projects. We live on the wifes old family farm. Her (now deceased) father has a house out here as well as her (now deceased) uncle. Her cousin lives in her uncles house and between us, we always seem to have a project or need for some extra muscle.

In fact, I've told the wife that if I literally, gave this machine away, we've made money on it for all the projects we've done around here. For example, she once asked me to move her day lillies.... wanted them dug up from 'here' and put over 'there'.

She was pretty incredulous when I walked right past the shovel....jumped on the backhoe.... dug a hole 'there' and then scooped up the flowers 'here' and dropped them in the newly dug hole. She didn't seem to understand the logic of if you have it.....use it!

I actually did use the floor jack. It was too small (short) to reach since I have the back end raised. I cut a 24" piece of plywood and cut a "V" in one end.

I set it vertically on the jack and put the "V" onto the cylinder end of the cylinder. Used it to jack it up a bit when I was trying to loosen them from their mounted position. I tried first to get on my back, use my foot to raise the back end of the cylinder while messing with the ram end. Realizing this was a bit precarious.... I decided to be more rational.

 

[BukitCase]

Might wanna clean the head of the bolt well enough to see what markings are on it - I'd be surprised if those aren't Grade 8 capscrews. If they ARE metric, triple check that the new ones match your thread pitch - there seems to be at least 3 different pitches for every diameter of metric bolt I've come across (one of my two other tractors was made in the baltic area and the other is a French-made Allis Chalmers. One of the hydraulic fittings on the AC is STILL a mystery, none of the fitting types or sizes I've found seem to match it.)

My wife's gotten used to it by now, isn't quite as much fun trying to surprise her. Initially I moved 4 30 foot long rows of Irises, an 8' tall Beauty Bush with a 3 foot root ball (from the front yard to the back) - a 15 foot tall Golden Bamboo with an 8 foot diameter root ball, etc - I have so many implement projects to build for the hoe it's become an avocation of its own

Looking at the rod on your last pic, it doesn't look like it'll need help on the finish, the seal probably just got tired with age... Steve

 

[skyhook]

Good job, Rick...:thumbsup:
Let us know what they charge you too reseal them.

 

[Richard]

Ready for some interesting numbers?

Called the dealer today. asked 'do you have and if so, how much for'

1. The 13" bolt to hold the trunnion plate on (four of them)
2. The nut to go with the bolt (also four of them)
3. The lock washer (which I didn't see/have when I took mine apart)

Also asked about the missing tack welded cover on the under side of the trunnion pivot. I now have a copy of their schematic in my hands and it in fact doesn't show one which suggests to me it might be part of the plate itself. I might call a welding shop for it.

Back to the nuts & bolts.....

He paused when he was reaching the price. I said (without him telling me anything yet) 'expensive, huh?!'

"yeah.... they're $27.00 per bolt"

"Well, I kind of presumed they'd be around $25... ok..."

Now, at this point, I was thinking the nuts would be about $5.00 each (which I find expensive)

"there are no lock washers for this....these are lock nuts"

(mmmm ok... )

The nuts are $25/each

So basically $200 plus shipping just to put new bolts on this. I may not even need replacement bolts (although one of them could use some thread dressing).... I look at it from the other point of view. If I cheap out on the bolts....and one of the old ones snaps, strips or can't be torqued all the way down, what kind of damage could occur to the back end?

So....I ordered them.

This will have a side effect of giving me four extra nuts. I might have their threads cleaned up, and use them as the second lock nut on the bottom.

Still....each piece, $25 a whack?

I did ask if this price included shipping.

After he got up from the floor laughing...... no.

 

[BukitCase]

I just bought some non machine-specific Grade 8 bolts last week for a 3 point scraper/smoother I'm designing - 7/8"x6 bolts, $6.75 each, nuts, $5 each, locks, over a buck each - so 6 bolts, 12 nuts, 12 locks, $135...

I keep having to remind myself it's cheaper than back surgery (that only dulls the pain in my wallet a LITTLE bit)... Steve

 

[skyhook]

Ouch!!!

 

[Richard]

About $950 to have them both fixed..... $200 for the nuts/bolts.....$25 to have a little plate welded on the bottom of the trunnion plate. $50 for 5 gallons of hydraulic oil to replace the $50 worth of oil that I put in 2 weeks ago before I realized I had the leak.

Having big toys is fun but, they're sure not inexpensive.