Rear Blade What can a rear blade do for me that my box blade can't? Road and ditches mainly

[/pine]

I'll disagree with this,
I use my back blades much more then my box blade.
I haven't even hooked up my box blade in two years.
Between cleaning the ditches and grading my driveway and moving snow my backblades are used dozens of times every year.
Based on experience...also!!!!

Those that have mastered (can I say that?) the learning curve of a box blade is like being able to catch a fly with chopsticks...and man who can do that...can do anything...!

Like I mentioned...rear blades do not have scarifiers/rippers and often with compact tractors and properly sized implements they can be paramount...
For minor grooming or small repair work...I will use whichever implement is already on the tractor...If even a small job is better suited for using the rear blade...In my experience it only takes a little more time and skill to do it with a box blade.

 

[CoyPatton]

I use my rear blade extensively in winter for snow. Probably not a problem down there in the south. But what I would point out is you really want the blade to be wider than the rear tire span.

 

[CoyPatton]

Those that have mastered (can I say that?) the learning curve of a box blade is like being able to catch a fly with chopsticks...and man who can do that...can do anything...!

Like I mentioned...rear blades do not have scarifiers/rippers and often with compact tractors and properly sized implements they can be paramount...
For minor grooming or small repair work...I will use whichever implement is already on the tractor...If even a small job is better suited for using the rear blade...In my experience it only takes a little more time and skill to do it with a box blade.

But some jobs just can not be well done with a BB. I own both. You might get by, but that’s is the best. But then you are probably one of those that should use a 6pt socket or wrench but have a pair of vise grips in your hands and round off all the shoulders. The entire time, thinking close enough!

 

[oosik]

As I mentioned - over the years I have traded, weaseled & bought my way to three implements I will use on the driveway.

If I had to choose one - the Rhino 950 rear blade. The LPGS does a great job but is quite specific. The box blade is nice but lacking for snow removal or driveway ditching - same as the LPGS.

For me and my needs, the rear blade is the most universal implement.

 

[CoyPatton]

So it looks like my little tractor has a recommended maximum weight for a three point implement of 1000lbs. The hitch lift capacity is higher though. So how big a blade can be reasonably hauled around on a 50 horse tractor that weighs 6500lbs + whatever the blade weighs? I'm starting to think 8 or 9' is gonna be the max.

In my opinion you want to limit your weight lifting to about 75-80% of the weight capacity (this provides some extra cushion on your hydraulics should you ever be in a bind or bouncing while transporting). Again go with a blade that is just wider than the stance of the rear of your tractor and then up to about 80% of your 3PH lifting capacity. If you think you need more reach than, look at blades that will off set (these have some type of a sliding mechanism build around the frame mount to the blade (although some low end models do this by unbolting the blade from the frame and relocating to different bolt patterns—most people do not like these!). If you think you need more tilt than your 3PH allows, there are also models than can allow the blade to tilt on the frame.

If you are the type of person who prefers to use a hammer as a hammer and not whatever is close, you want both types of blades! The right tool for the job, not a get by!

 

[LouNY]

Those that have mastered (can I say that?) the learning curve of a box blade is like being able to catch a fly with chopsticks...and man who can do that...can do anything...!

Like I mentioned...rear blades do not have scarifiers/rippers and often with compact tractors and properly sized implements they can be paramount...
For minor grooming or small repair work...I will use whichever implement is already on the tractor...If even a small job is better suited for using the rear blade...In my experience it only takes a little more time and skill to do it with a box blade.

As you have mentioned in slightly different words you can be a very arrogant know it all.

I would put my tractor and equipment operating skills up against yours any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
Also I have moved and level a considerable amount of ground with different styles of box blades and scrapper cans.

You can not dig a deep narrow ditch is rocky ground with a box blade.
You can not windrow material while driving forward to mix with added material while spreading it back out.
You can not plow a long winding narrow driveway of a deep snow fall efficiently with a box blade.

 

[MechanicalGuy]

In my opinion you want to limit your weight lifting to about 75-80% of the weight capacity (this provides some extra cushion on your hydraulics should you ever be in a bind or bouncing while transporting). Again go with a blade that is just wider than the stance of the rear of your tractor and then up to about 80% of your 3PH lifting capacity. If you think you need more reach than, look at blades that will off set (these have some type of a sliding mechanism build around the frame mount to the blade (although some low end models do this by unbolting the blade from the frame and relocating to different bolt patterns—most people do not like these!). If you think you need more tilt than your 3PH allows, there are also models than can allow the blade to tilt on the frame.

If you are the type of person who prefers to use a hammer as a hammer and not whatever is close, you want both types of blades! The right tool for the job, not a get by!

So the three point hitch has a 2300lb capacity but the implement max recommended is 1000lbs. What do you think about that? Is 1000lb all that is reasonable and safe for that tractor? Or is the manufacturer just being overly conservative and cya.

 

[LouNY]

The weight rating that the 3 point can lift is usually defined as at the lift arms or 24" past them.
On a rear blade whose frame is long enough for the blade to be spun in 360 degrees much of the weight is much further back then 24" from the pins,
and if yours is one that is rated at the lift arms the leverage effect is much greater,
a 1000 pounds at the end of the lift arms is much easier for the tractor then the same 1000 pounds if it is 5 feet back.

 

[fried1765]

I'll disagree with this,
I use my back blades much more then my box blade.
I haven't even hooked up my box blade in two years.
Between cleaning the ditches and grading my driveway and moving snow my backblades are used dozens of times every year.
Based on experience...also!!!!

Ditto!
I have a new box blade that has sat in my barn for 4 years.
I ONLY use my.... EA 6-way Deluxe Scrape Blade.

 

[airbiscuit]

I always thought this was a clever design.

 

[airbiscuit]

I have a mile long gravel/sand/volcanic ash driveway. After 39 years - all three materials are well mixed. After the spring rains it hardens up just like concrete. I have three implements that I use on the driveway. Each has its "best use". A VERY heavy Rhino rear blade - 96" @ 1010#. A Land Pride LPGS( 84" ) with scarifiers. A Bush Hog ROBB( 72" ) with scarifiers.

I've found that any road project goes better if a specific implement is used. I have no need to push an implement to do something it's not really designed to accomplish.

Snow removal and driveway ditches - rear blade.

Remove riffles, potholes, etc - LPGS with scarifiers.

Move material, dig to modify grade or slope - ROBB with scarifiers.

Any of these implements will perform any of the listed tasks, but no one is best for all. Here are the implements I use - sorted most to least.

Road Drag to maintain 1/2 mile road (like a grader/scraper)

Horse Drawn Grader to create crown, smooth and sculpt ground, ditch, etc.

Box Blade to scarify potholes and move dirt

Rear Blade for plowing snow, and some gravel work (gets used less since I bought a rear pull snowblower)


If I could only have one, it would be the Horse Drawn Grader. Nothing can match it for utility, finesse and ease of use. That said, it's nice having them all and using each for what it's best at.

 

[CoyPatton]

The weight rating that the 3 point can lift is usually defined as at the lift arms or 24" past them.
On a rear blade whose frame is long enough for the blade to be spun in 360 degrees much of the weight is much further back then 24" from the pins,
and if yours is one that is rated at the lift arms the leverage effect is much greater,
a 1000 pounds at the end of the lift arms is much easier for the tractor then the same 1000 pounds if it is 5 feet back.

 

[CoyPatton]

The weight rating that the 3 point can lift is usually defined as at the lift arms or 24" past them.
On a rear blade whose frame is long enough for the blade to be spun in 360 degrees much of the weight is much further back then 24" from the pins,
and if yours is one that is rated at the lift arms the leverage effect is much greater,
a 1000 pounds at the end of the lift arms is much easier for the tractor then the same 1000 pounds if it is 5 feet back.

As LouNY points out, there are lifting definitions that you have not provided which leaves all of us a bit blind. How can your tractor handle 2300 lbs? Is this for a pull type implement or weight limit at the pins in the tractor or at the rear ball swivel of the lower arms? Or is your 1000 lbs at the rear swivel balls of the lower arms or some inches behind it. If tour lower arms are like most, you only have a few inches of length at most past your rear tires at the end of the lower arms’! Now consider you buy a 72” blade. At the center of of that blades pivot, you need 36” total from the rear most point of your tire tread to make it turn for it to swing 360 degrees. (Personally I would not have one that won’t do this). If that is a forced turn past your tires, you risk tread damage every single time, and if your hand is there.....you are going to ER most likely.
All that said to point out that the manufacturer is going to build the frame longer to do allow for this, which now means for that 1000 lbs, sitting another 12-18” beyond that common point that you tractor cites the lifting capacity needs more force to be lifted or at that distance, your 3PH will lift less weight!
Another point is, I can always add some weight to the blade, but trying to remove weight because the blade is too heavy for the tractor, may compromise the blade—if I just bought a new blade and paid the premium price for it, I do not want to be taking a cutting torch to it!

 

[MechanicalGuy]

2300lbs @24" behind lift point. Does this mean 2300lbs at the pins themselves? Or 24" out past the pins? The lift arms might be 24" long. I'm thinking 24" past the point that the lower pins are.

 

[Smokeydog]

My 7’ woods offset grader blade is all my 60hp 4x4 tractors can handle on some spots of my 1/2mile mountain driveway. Off set past the tire on one side keeps me out of the ditch and trees. Do find the grader blade more useful than box blade for maintenance. Both have sat unused for years since getting a EA land plane and driveway maintenance time drastically been reduced.

 

[/pine]

As you have mentioned in slightly different words you can be a very arrogant know it all.

I would put my tractor and equipment operating skills up against yours any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
Also I have moved and level a considerable amount of ground with different styles of box blades and scrapper cans.

You can not dig a deep narrow ditch is rocky ground with a box blade.
You can not windrow material while driving forward to mix with added material while spreading it back out.
You can not plow a long winding narrow driveway of a deep snow fall efficiently with a box blade.

Go back and read what I posted moe...before you go shooting your mouth off.. show me a picture of a DEEP NARROW DITCH you dug with a rear blade...no matter how deep you can maybe get it there will always be a sloped shoulder...

And BTW I'm LMAO because 99.999% of the time a box blade gets less use than a rear blade for general grading and lane grooming etc...is because the owner/operator is simply not sufficient with it...a rear blade is much more forgiving...and land planes are even more forgiving...

And one other thing moe...FYI...I rarely if ever make posts in threads that I don't actually know something about...unlike some that feel compelled to post an opinion because they just think they know something about a topic etc...

 

[MechanicalGuy]

No need to get insulty-wise towards each other guys, I have learned something from every response and I'm happy to get this information from experienced people. I want to understand what benefits a scraper could give me if I get one and this thread is helping.

 

[CoyPatton]

2300lbs @24" behind lift point. Does this mean 2300lbs at the pins themselves? Or 24" out past the pins? The lift arms might be 24" long. I'm thinking 24" past the point that the lower pins are.

In my opinion, neither!
In my opinion your lift point is the location where the rods from your lift arms attach to your lower arms.
Confused yet?
It is not unusual that reference points in tractor data manuals are at strange reference points. To complicate this more, the weight of the lower arms probably counts against the 2300 lbs.
Allow me to jump to Front End Loaders for a moment. It is common for loaders to give a weight lifting capacity in from of the pins at a given distance.
However, any attachment connected to the loader (bucket or forks or grapple) must be included into those weight factors. So if the loader literature says 850 lbs at 24” from the pins. The weight of the bucket is a part of the 850 lbs. you can lift, but to further complicate that,a portion of the weight is at the pins and the 24” is probably at cutting edge of the bucket. Day your bucket weighs 100 lbs, how much has your lifting capacity bern reduced?
So to try to help be more helpful on that distance, at 24” from the lift point, many implements will be within or just beyond that range (BB, tiller and such sized implements. Where a 5’ brush cutter will largely extend beyond that distance. A standard rear blade will have most of its weight beyond that distance.

 

[MtnViewRanch]

No need to get insulty-wise towards each other guys, I have learned something from every response and I'm happy to get this information from experienced people. I want to understand what benefits a scraper could give me if I get one and this thread is helping.

IMO, the perfect rear blade for your tractor would be a Land Pride RBT3596 or an RBT4096.

You can get it with all manual adjustments or individual functions with a hydraulic as you like.

I highly recommend skid shoes, others may or may not.

Good luck with all your research and your ultimate decision.

 

[rScotty]

Many of the better angle blades - Woods, Servis, & Land Pride RB35 series for example - have optional end pieces called "ears" that make an angle blade able to carry dirt like a box blade. But I've never seen a box blade that could be made to do much angle or offset At best they might tilt just a little.
rScotty