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Asking because I've never heard it asked & I bet it's pretty rare - I am considering removing my rear remotes from my ck10 (ck2610) for reasons; any advice on how to sell or price them? Tractor has ~200 hours, the remotes are in perfect condition & are not a low/intermittent use part anyway...

Link for @Billrog "ck27". TractorData.com Kioti CK27 tractor information. i don't have one so don't know, but that link says sold through 2014 in whatever was "ck20" series at that time. Which could have changed over time for sure. Mine is a ck2610h, which is a "ck10 series". H for HST. The...

So both the fixed/stock, and telescoping links are BOTH ~28" I suppose perhaps there could exist multiple lower lengths of fixed for ck10/ck20... seems less likely?

well, my dealer has a pair of fixed/non-telescoping links, ostensibly from a ck10, and claims they are 28" center-to-center. I never volunteered the length of my telescoping arms (also ~28") On the one hand, this would make sense; there is no reason the telescoping units couldn't be built to...

Well, thats sort of the impetus fpr the question. Putting in an surpluscenter order, they stock the BrandHyd checks i was looking for - but (literally) 2x the cost for the flatfaced vs taper, and even they have ~30 npt's in stock, but only 3 bspp's (i need 4 :( So yeah, parrallel, flat sealing...

In another life (work $ + robustness requirements) we would go BSPP 100% given the choice. It's a better design, relying on the elastomeric seal is generally regarded as being much more robust than relying on sealant and thread deformation. Custom hydraulic work, on my own, is new to me...

putting this in a separate reply, as it would be a doozie if I've missed something ... I was not able to find any way to get float in the valve AND have load-holding / DPOCV's. As much as I need float, it would be a huge step back if I mess something up because I didn't notice the cylinder...

Ha. Don't worry, no offense taken, it would not be the first time. Realistically I do enjoy just learning about all the things ... Your help here is phenomenal, thanks for what you do for the community. In this case specifically what I want is to have float for both my top (for leveling...

Interesting - I do certainly trust you know what you're talking about. When I thought about it above, it just seemed like a bad idea to have that much play in the mechanism around the quick-hitch. Yes, it's meant to be a ball joint. But the quick-hook already has more play than a proper Heim...

what you're referencing is not relevant to my question, which per the title is specifically about drift. It is also of questionable relevance to the rear hydraulics in general - having nothing to do with why the DPOCV is commonly spec'd on top&tilt cylinders - but since I didn't ask that I see...

Thanks. I hadn't seen links with the slots, those are clever. I have a couple implements "sized up" vs my tractor, such as a large blade, wbich have that built in. None of the economy or true "cat1" size stuff i have ever considered have it which is a shame. Not compatible with wanting a...

Ah you are right. They are tiny with no boxes drawn around them, i looked, and completely missed. Thats pretty definitive. Now, for the betting pool on ratio of: - days to get an informed answer on TBN - days to get the same from the oem/vendor :) thanks for your help!

Interesting, i read it the opposite, need to call in: From Monoblock Hydraulic Directional Control Valve, 1 Spool, 11 GPM > Anti-drop load checks on each spool Maybe "drop" here is referencing mkre of safety "if this cheap valve fails with engine off, load cant free-fall"?

I think you're getting a how to DEpressurize valve2's pilots, right? I had assumed that leakage of either the solenoid valve i'd use to control the pilot line (basically 2 position, dead-headed into the pilot line) - or leakage/minkr flow through the pilot itself - would take care if bleeding...

with a double check valve (same type as is typically mounted directly to the cylinder), IFF it was "remote pilot", I believe you could trivially do this with a small pilot line. Also retain the drift-locking behavior the DPOCV was added in the first place. Using two separate pilot operated...

Many directional valves advertise built-in load checks. Are these as effective as the standard double-pilot operated check valve typically hard-lined directly to the cylinder of top & tilts? Obviously putting the check at the directional valve will introduce a minor amount of bounce to the...

Typical top&tilt cylinders use a normal Double Pilot-operated check to prevent drift. Dark blue Valve1 in the picture. All these uber-compact double check valves use internal pilots for the obvious reason of size & cost. However, if one exposed the pilots (eg "remote" or "external"), then...

Ok, a bit much on the spelling police. We've all done it. Personally I just chose to read it as chaotrophic, a new field of study about chaos in the food chain.

Scaffolding is diffucult to get into the forrest, and needs a very good footing. I own scaffolding.

I ordered the ignite landscape rake. It showed up in 2 days. I was unaware freight could be so fast, lol!

Its my understanding (per brian) that there is no dedicated cat1 top link hook - a cat1 arm would its ball/clevis end sized for (actual) cat1, but the hook is the same cat1 & cat2. The balls, then, share an OD but are sold with either cat1 or cat2 ID's. Note that the ball overall width needs...

they don't seem to list any specs on their site - what the min/max lengths on the top & side travel cylinders?

Thanks for confirming. Unclear if this is accurate or not, according to my dealer, see below Since I'm switching to easy-to-connect quick disconnect "euro hooks" as well as top-and-tilt, I will be fine without the telescoping links. I don't believe I've seen any practical limitations being ~4"...

how did you choose the length range of your cylinder? It seems the cylinder travel will necessarily be less than my top-link's adjustability: the top euro hook reduces the available travel by an inch or three (it's just physically longer than the normal ball) a hydraulic cylinder is not simply...

I have a 2022(1?) ck2610. I believe this answer would be the same for any of the other CK10 series. I HAVE the telescoping lower links, but am trying to choose a hydraulic top-link length and it's right in-between. I'm trying to determine if the "stock" / NON-telescoping lower links are...

I can't for the life of me find said tutorial either here on TBN or in a google. Could you share a link or something more specific I should search for? Thanks! (PS mods: if @MtnViewRanch wrote a valve tutorial/faq, can it be stickied on the hydraulics forum?)

Thanks. It's looking like these, or some sort of chain attachment, are my options. IDK - I'm sure you're correct about the counterbalance being used in safety situations, but I don't design this sort of equipment / am no hydraulic expert, presently I'd feel a LOT better about something purely...

As in the OP, I'm talking about the bucket cylinders not the main/arm cylinders. I am already using a block for the arm cylinders.

You're correct that any deformation caused by the bolts will dramatically decrease a tube's resistance to buckling (see: a dented pop can). But less so about the tube's behavior in buckling overall. I'm replying because we're discussing implementing safety features. The actual mechanics of...

My mechanics-of-materials is screaming BUCKLING BUCKLING! :) Just giving you a hard time. A great safety feature. But since we're talking safety - I can't not add here don't rely on that for anything beyond a true backup. While you didn't state tube specs, it's likely a fine safety factor in...

Do you have a P/N or an image from search? I am not seeing anything obvious in an image search (and the vendor websites seem worthless as none have any pictures...)

I have lower hooks from you, ~two years later I'm welding them up now :) I am also doing top-link now, and figure I'd regret not getting a hook for the top. Looking through all the pictures, how do folks keep the top hook aligned while unattached? It's on a cylinder, so free-rotating right...

I can't figure out what you mean by "hand crank gearing" - could you describe more or share a pic? Thanks!

For a moment I thought I had a good solution - now that I'm moving to the "ball joint" connection (pic attached for anyone not already familiar), I could just "fix" the balls side-to-side. I have to leave a set of balls per-implement, anyway, so just cutting a spacer per implement would be...

Well, that's a good point. They are close enough I hadn't been concerned about this - but I probably should have ascertained how off-axis they are. Tractor is at the cabin, but from the pics I can find on my PC they look pretty darn close. Considering there is flex everywhere, and that...

Did you bolt or weld on something to the FEL arms for an attachment? I suppose that would probably work. Keep in mind use-case here is a bit different than the main arm cylinders - for those, in general, you're preventing the arm from falling "a lot" and crushing you. On a work platform a...

See the OP. The bucket (specifically) is already off, I'm talking about a work platform on forks. And I'm on it, not under it.

Interesting idea. I don't like the thought of putting more moving parts there, but this would seem to be "pretty close" to the safety provided by the arm cylinder lockout bars.

If there was a "load binder Hope he does ... note when I've heard the term "telescoping" it's been for something like this - which is great for some uses, but as in the OP (I believe) I need something that can snug it up to prevent the whole implement from rattling & jumping around. Even...

I'm looking for a replacement/improved version of the side-tensioner for my 3point hitch. I'm finally getting around to installing my weld-on Euro hooks. It will be fantastic to finally have quick hitch - and just in time as I happen to have a lot of implement I'll be doing this spring. I...

I have cylinder stops (these; same function as u-channel designs of varying polish), which I bought for when I needed to be working under the arms. I need to use my forks to hold a work platform. I can tie in, so with the FEL arms safe, the "worst" that could happen is a complete hydraulic...

I tried to read the info that's available; the local news in that area is the only source that seems to have covered it; they are paywalled (but workarounds like running it through 12ft worked for me). I only saw mention of Ted, the principal I believe (pretty lavish lifestyle, etc), and...

Any experience with Compact Equipment Attachments & Implements | Ignite Attachments ? I can't find much/any folks owning them here. I am comparing a 72" landscape rake; ignite is about half the price comparted to some of the other made-in usa, real close to import prices. Their design looks...

Have ratchet rake on the way. About 95% decided on a landscape rake for the rear. Trying to decide between an EA** rake (i can get just the rake, built to fit my EA blade's frame), or an import, or an "Ignite" branded rale which claims usa made but i have never heard of. ** they confirmed...

Unfortunately it's under 4ft of snow for the foreseeable future (although it is getting HOT this week) - I didn't mean to muddy the water, just describe that I had some other uses where the blade definitely won't work, and I haven't purchased a solution yet, which slightly increases the ROI on...

I should add to my reply about the plane/blade/box-blade: The "other uses" I mentioned in the OP are in the woods to make some rudimentary fire breaks. In my situation my blade won't be that useful due to buried obstacles. I'm surrounded by high-risk wildfire country. There are certain...

I have a 72" (Edit: BLADE, not plane, sorry i misspoke) from EA, with side wings. essentially a box blade, sans scarifiers). So not quirmte the same function as a plane. The problem here is that a stump or unseen rock will HALT the tractor. I grind most of the stumps, so they are not always...

IDK, i can't imagine that specific implementation (weight, rigidity, lack thereof) doing much compared to a drag harrow?

add a bunch of chain-link fence, and some weight, and that's about what pop used :)

I have about a half-acre of lawn to finish. It'll be rough-leveled by a combination of blade/box-blade and FEL float, but from past experience I wouldn't want that to be my final surface. I have a 25hp TLB and a JD lawn tractor. I've been been considering a landscape rake for this (such as...

I have a blade with sides - basically a nice blade with improved dirt-moving ability - used for some minor re-grading around a property we're developing. And I don't have any driveways, etc, that would really help me justify the functionality of a full box. That said - I hadn't thought of...

Looking to buy a subsoiler w/ pipe-laying attachment. I will only use it very lightly, and don't need to go deep - so was planning on buying from AgriSupply PIPELAYER F/ASC 73410A + 3PT SUBSOILER RIPPER 1 totaling ~$325. They want $450 to ship it to a major metro in Idaho?? (I would pick it...

Ok, looks like no feedback against non-moly lithium (Red-N-Tacky), so put in an order for that. Should have about a years supply now :) To tl;dr for any future readers, this is what I'm using going forward: 3% moly lithium-complex (Deere TY6333) for: Slow + Sliding (bushings in loader pins...

based on Project Farm's results, I suppose I should also consider a high-quality lithium-complex NON-moly grease for the high-speed applications (such as Lucas Red "N" Tacky he reviewed very positively) Side benefit is that I couldn't mess anything up if I used the wrong gun (since both are...

Small TLB here with a few implements that have bearings such as a pto snowblower, pto chipper. I've just used the same grease all around until now - but it's been nagging me and I doubt my lithium/moly grease correct for the "fast" or "spinning" interfaces. For the loader, BH, grapple, etc -...

I have the kioti 2475 - could you confirm the pin spacing & size on your 2485? See pics over at Backhoe - Kioti Backhoe Bucket, but the key specs are: 1 inch pins bucket ears have two pins - but the offset between those pins is not critical, since the 2nd pin is on a swingarm. ears on bucket...

I normally wouldn't resurrect a 15yo thread, but dusty's done that for me :) I am looking for the same - a narrow trenching bucket for my kb2475l (ck2610 hse tractor). Can anyone with the NH, LS etc confirm theirs against the Kioti? here's the spec's of the kioti bucket: 1" pins ~136mm /...

Looking to make a cover for my sawmill and a few other less-weatherproof tools** which at least for a the next several years will be stored outside. I've tried tarps, but: with the relatively harsh & consistent sun we get they degrade faster than i'd like because they are fully waterproof (not...

Thanks for the clarification. FWIW i haven't found as clear of terminology in the "mobile" world, vs the "industrial" community [definitely standard names, btw]. I'm sure it exists, maybe it's just more-specialized/smaller user group (of folks actually engineering things that is). Which would...

Read the definition i linked. As best i can tell, there is no name in common use w.r.t. the semantics of flow i'm talking about. Farmerford provided workable definitions that will save a whole lot of hot air.

Yep, have power beyond. But the valves on my tractor, like virtually all smaller TLB's, are "tandem valved -VS- series"**, so i can't use my full meager flow simultaneously. I only expect to use it as such when the tools are ~unloaded (no magic here) ... but that use, like when "repositioning"...

agreed on the noise. That said, there aren't that many operations in an TLB that will trigger this any more than momentarily when something reaches end of travel. And once you get used to a machine, that's not happening a ton.

Prince got back to me, RV series with 1/2 inch ports (the smallest option) will have negligeable pressure drop. ~1/2 PSI at my 7gpm.

talked to a Prince FE; they're going to get back to me on the actual pressure across (Pin --> Pout), but they did note that the RV line ("differential poppet inline relief") is the exact same cartridge style that is used in Prince FEL valves. So that adds a fair amount of confidence as that's...

I agree with this; there is also the issue of air that would start in the system if not bled. Which means we're all on the same page that it's not just the cylinders here - other parts of the system esp valves are possible points to introduce air. From what I've read online it's really not...

If you don't already have one, buy a beam torque wrench Amazon.com : beam torque wrench ~ $30 ... unlike all other styles, these are " calibration free" as long as you don't drop/damage it, how much the needle moves is simple deflection of the steel beam. They are not the most accurate - but...

Good question - am i understanding this wrong? Call the three ports on a pressure relief valve Pin, Pout, and T(ank). I see the high head across the relief valves "when they are relieving" eg open Pin-->Tank But my understanding is I would adjust that valve such that my actual system pressure...

first, 2000+ psi is no joke. Among other things, it's an injection hazard; and if you have something that is going to fail under pressure, it can fail HARD, and cause death. Your post makes me a little nervous for you - not trying to offend, just trying to help. That said, reversing the lines...

> the factory loader and it is plumbed into the two rear remotes the rear remotes are driving the front loader? As in the tractor doesn't have a dedicated FEL valve? Sorry, must be missing something, or just haven't seen that config before. If the tractor came with a FEL, i'd expect you have...

if you had known you wouldn't re-use the housing from the get-go the lead tech of the shop i worked at back in high school would just hammer his largest screwdriver through a stubborn filter and use that for leverage :)

what lines are getting this hot @joea99 ? Just checking we're talking about a "normal" mobile system like a tractor. The max fluid temp in a normal tractor system is not that hot as even plastics go (your skin ... not so tough! :) ) The "hose protectors" that came on my Kioti are simply...

Ignoring the seal issue (do they vent? not vent?) it's entirely possible that this could simply work it's way out "on it's own". If the air-entrained side of the cylinder is "up" - then any free air would get forced completely out next time the cylinder moves, as the [volume of cylinder] >>...

This cannot account for purging all the air - the unloaded side of the cylinder doesn't pull a vacuum - the volume of air that remains in the hose, valves, (IE doesn't "make it back" to the reservoir or a check valve) is not going to go anywhere [see below...] ^ UNLESS there is another path...

AFAICT, it's only safety / longevity of pump that I'm "worried" about regarding actual performance of the device, not so much how much a human operator would notice anything. I'm not really sure what there is to "notice" in relief valve operation, anyway - a larger audio "pop" at the beginning...

Correct - i hope that pressure drop line to tank would be 100% of my system pressure :) The "cartridge" aspect was actually what prompted this question. The RV series is a cartridge BUT goes up to 3000psi. The smaller RD series (RD-1800) is a "direct acting" ball (cuttaway seems to show...

For the curious, the modified system will flow pump --> (new) pressure relief obviously has it's own return to tank --> (new) valve, tandem center; size D05 for minimal pressure losses P->T** **T is fully pressurized here. There is no return to tank on this valve/manifold. So the...

None of the "datasheets" for relief valves I can find seem to provide a flow-vs-pressure-drop curve. I'd like to know so I can verify the heat load & pressure loss I'm incurring here is acceptable. --- I'm modifying my hydraulic system to function with a grapple as if it were built into my...

Sorry, I should have spelled it out in my OriginalPost - I meant OverPressure valve. Definitely required if i go upstream of FEL valve, as otherwise I'd blow the pump when the cylinder is dead-headed: And on the heat / power loss - I think you're probably right, or at least close enough, on...

if this is even close to accurate, i really should just use a monoblock (not a standard / repairable - but folks seem to have them last), or my single D03 + port multiplier (doesn't package as out-of-the-way) 200+ psi drop or more PSI is definitely way too much to loose - that's over 3/4 hp...

I wasn't able to find pressure drop for a series manifold. I would really like to know, thought!

Yes, I'm concerned about this; cartridge valves while smaller would be even worse. My tractor is only 6-7gpm for the implements, so on the lower end there, but as you say that's PER VALVE. As opposed to a monoblock design which (according to Summit & how I read this chart - i believe the curve...

I'm thinking of buying some valves from Summit, but this will be my first foray into real modifications to my (or any) hydraulic system. I have my head around what I need and generally what the options are (I think, famous last words) ... Summit seems to be one of the only games in town that...

I know there is some overlap in what you/Fit-Rite sells (and I had a great experience ordering Euro 3-pt hooks from you, thanks; and of course greatly appreciate your contributions here on the public forum.) It does seem another benefit of industrial (Dxx) manifolds & valves is they are a...

Absolutely! ;) but thanks for being sure The only potential issue i see here is that, without a dump to tank, the "industrial" valves in series have the possibility of introducing overpressure downstream: Valve 1 open to extend the cylinder, which is partway through its stroke and ~unloaded...

I should add that one "less-common" design goal for the 3rd function / grapple: I would like to be able to operate the grapple AND the loader, at FULL FLOW, for "unloaded repositioning" operations - eg, open grapple & lower FEL with both going at full speed (full hydraulic flow). I'm...

three solenoid valves - two rear solenoid remotes (top & tilt, a personal project I'd like to automate), and a 3rd function (grapple via new rocker on loader lever). All Tandem valved Grapple circuit is mandatory, and needed now - and overall effort isn't a whole lot more (esp considering the...

Thanks, that's at least the right model, and for sale with a price! FWIW, I had searched bailey's and grainger and surpluscenter (plenty of valves, no Deutsch as best i can tell). Also, Hyvair has a sku for these, D03sds (vs the typical D03s; and they also have a bare-lead version D03L which...

Yeah, these devices work by playing back the "same" sound, out of phase. Problem is it's not exactly the same, and it's not completely understood if & how that matters. a perfect inverted wave will certainly cancel -it just adds-, but these inverted (from the noise cancelling circuitry) is...

I need a D03 manifold & valves with slightly lower height. The common style with "DIN" connectors is typically about 6.5" tall - slightly too tall to fit where I'd prefer to mount it. The best option I've found would be these, with "Deutsch Connectors". The lower total heigh, around 5.5"...

Correct, totally get that. the moments where a cylinder is bottoming out and the OP valve would activate are a tiny fraction of the entire cycle of operating the system; so this is more functional for my use just considering the grapple use. However, it gets even more important if I am able to...

I do appreciate the replies, but no offense, but this is a pretty standard non-answer. Closed center is superior to open center in just about every way except cost. Which is why us small-tractor owners are stuck with it; manufacturers have more incentive to hit a price point, and even for...

what I'm taking from this is the same as I came in with :) 1/2" will probably most likely work, but it may (will?) not be optimal. Ok, so having a small tractor I don't want to loose any more pressure drop than I need - there aren't that many fittings should I replace some. what fitting flows...

the example with gravity is a good one, except for the fact that the "bad" condition there is user-choice. If speed of movement on that one cylinder is the user's priority, then they would not operate a downstream function (because, as you say, the "backpressure" would interfere with their...

our fresh piles of wood chips, one large utility truck's worth (maybe 5'tall, 8'wide, 12' long) would smoke, and be uncomfortably hot inside. This in a mild climate, with plenty of water, and never covered. I don't think you'd need too many variables 'worse' to get ignition: significantly...

a few sources, including the Summit spec sheet, seem to indicate that it's not always a ball ... does this track your experience, or should all AG/5675 connectors use a ball?

slightly smaller tractor than you (but I only bought the 2610 to avoid tier4 ...) most of my implements are brand names, but for the PHD I did go tractor-supply / country line https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/countyline-3-point-post-hole-digger-602377 I've been happy with it. My soil...

Trying to make sure i understand how this is different/better than a box blade: If you are not using the "reverse direction scraping" feature (I wouldn't either, that seems marginal unless you have a really tight space; even then, FEL + float?) so the only difference (if you use...

So the ROBB does forward-scraper and reverse scraper ... but in scarifier mode the tines are behind the blade?

Here's an analogy that is surprisingly accurate. Stand at a teatherball pole, hit the ball repeatedly, trying to keep it, smoothly, at a specific height/distance from pole (straight out, not in a circle) Small, well timed taps of the appropriate force... if you could tap VERY fast, you could...

That is 100% correct. The input is digitial (pulses; anywhere from 100's to megahertz depending on app/industry - idk what hydraulic proportional valves use, kHz would be common in general) The output is a "transfer function" (systems speak)**, which quantifies how a particular input will...

Turbo comes from the old days when plenty of software (especially games, but also office sw) was coded with certain expectations of the processor's specific clock rate. The "turbo" button just made the cpu run at its actual full speed, which "non turbo" essentially a compatibility mode. or...

Dup

What are ROBB (_ _ box blade?), LPGS?

Thank you; that confirms how i was thinking about the flow, and would be an improvement over the existing remotes + additional remote/grapple The biggest sticking point now is size - D03 fits great, D05 is nearly twice the size :( which would be tough. I guess all the off the shelf versions i...

the other part of my question is flow pattern IN the manifold - are the valves in series? The datasheet confused me - the header says "parallel circuit" (not what I want) but the model number has S in it (circled, purple) - not defined in Hyvair's doc, but at some distributors this is called...

I suppose I'd need to go with D05 series if I go with this plan: model #2c in D05 (passes through PB in center) is curve 6 P->T pressure https://hyvair.com/wp-content/uploads/catalogs/d05solenoid.pdf Thats only ~15 psi per valve at 7gpm, seems manageable.

Not 100% sure I'm reading the flow chart correctly, but perhaps I am given I also come up with a "bad" number: standard valve for my application would be a #2C I believe. This is curve #3 on the P->T path (normal operation / no valve in use) OUCH - that's ~50 psi per valve pressure drop at...

The constraints that are leading me to a single large manifold are: space. i'm pressed for it. I could bolt ~whatever to the ROPS, but I don't like that solution (interferes with view of implement/ground on that side, and if i were put anything up there i want it to be a toolbox). if I'm...

Hyvair style D03 (ISO 4401) size valves&manifolds seem in common use for small TLB applications (summit kits for rear remote & port multiplier, w.r.long 3rd function kits). It seems that D03 spec valves are spec'd for ~16gpm or higher (plenty, my tractor has 7gpm) But all the D03 manifolds are...

so PB flow is maintained while featuring; this is good. (also, Dump and Curl are in parallel -according to schematic- so with no load they both move simultaneously, but would likely follow sequence of least resistance if loaded) But regarding my original question about FEL cylinder flow being...

Ok, after re-testing more carefully, you are correct; flow is sent to PB (until the FEL valve(s) is fully opened. So basically it "transitions" [somewhat] linearly from hold-position to [eg] up-position. Question: Assuming this is standard, if a valve does _not_ do this, is it noted on the...

withIN the two FEL circuits, i do believe it functions like this (although it's HARD to find that sweet spot where both are moving, it does appear that it's possible).

the one(?) part of the flow that does NOT make sense to me is - what happens to the PB flow when you haven't opened the valve fully? This is not covered by either the manual's schematic above, or my alternative. Eg, during "feathering" the cylinder is not consuming the full pump flow; and I...

My FEL completely cuts off the flow to the remaining PB. IE: when you're using UP/DOWN or CURL, rear remotes, 3rd function, etc cease all function. I understand this is ~universal. But why? here's the schematic from the manual (with some annotations to help, as these are hard to read if you...

worth noting the other difference with this "four port" (vs 5-port with tank drain) valve (also, "pressure-rated Tank drain" is another good description): The most common cylinder valves route: pressure to one side of the cylinder (obviously) and the other end to tank this guarantees that...

It entirely depends on the valve. I know (because I have one in hand) that W.R.Long sells a 3rd function valve with ONLY 4 ports - NO return to tank. It's generally mounted up right by your FEL valves. This valve would be perfect for your application; put it "in line" with your backhoe...

There are many different types of valves. If the specific valve requires tank(atmosphere drain) then YES it requires it. But this is not the case for all valves. Take this Summit 3rd function valve with EXACTLY FOUR ports. NO tank here. And note that some valves can do BOTH - in this case the...

You don't *have* to use a return to tank (eg unpressurized) here You can use the same valve as a 3rd function, which will have four ports in use: cylinder A, B, power beyond in, power beyound out. Many of these 3rd function valves are on/off, meaning the valve is kept simple. keep in mind its...

Thanks - I'm looking for confirmation of models with MORE horsepower but the same #3a165 1.647 L engine - eg the pre-ck10 series like the ck35 (so i hear). with a known 3a165 model of higher output, i can compare the parts diagrs to see what (if anything) is different to tollerate the...

I am trying to compare engine, cooling, etc details between the ck2610, and the previous models that this thread mentions had the exact same engine, such as the CK35, to gauge how comfortable I am bumping up the power. I have the service manual for the ck2610, need confirmation of what other...

See my OP

~45lbs is simply atmospheric pressure, applied to a to a ~3inch diameter circle. Yes, that stays ~constant. We *are* starting to get to spherical cows, and TBC that's not my area :) How far does it have to move? That depends entirely on the assumptions we have to apply to simplify the...

I couldn't find estimates of the elasticity of the container(s) here, so i just took an estimate of fluid compressibility. Do you have any educated-WAGs at expansion of the hoses? estimating strain in the cylinder itself would be straightforward enough just looking at hoop stress, if I knew...

AFAICT this is just a thought exercise, trying to add some intuitive understanding if one hasn't taken a statics or fluids course. Agreed, in the real world there is fluid on the other side of that cylinder, and that fluid is constrained by a closed valve ... you are not going to move that...

if you're going to the trouble of welding the link - look at a quick release! I bought mine from FitRite after learning of Euro Style 3pt quick release fittings here (but i can't for the life of me fine the thread!) here's a pic of top & bottom; I see some vendors online, but out of stock...

Yes, the lowest the pressure on the 'cavitation' side could have is zero. std 1atm is ~14.7psi. Ignoring friction, ambient pressure on the rod area itself, asymmetries, etc, it's only the fluid pressure on the opposing side exerting force on the plunger. At a minimum that fluid is vented to...

the only other detail to check is overpressure: when you fully-open your new valve for the TnT cylinder, you'll be fully diverting flow from the power beyond "loop", through the cylinder. Pressure builds, cylinder starts moving as intended. Eventually, the cylinder tops/bottoms out ... at...

@LS Tractor Owner phrased it well - it is quite simple once you understand some of the principles. This thread helped me: Alternative 3rd function? what you're doing is identical to putting a mechanically valved 3rd function for a grapple. you'll need the open center valve. After...

I'm referring to the infeed ONLY - flywheel is driven from pto. Please clarify if its the infeed you refer to, doesnt seem like that would feed high impulse loads back to the hydraulics?

Perfect vacuum? Not possible since you have finite space + pre-existing particles :) Since there is obviously no such thing as "negative pressure", the cavitating (not sure if this is specifically a correct usage btw, but seems close enough) space will just ~approach zero ~ and probably not...

I haven't yet dealt much with hydraulic motors, so please forgive if this should be obvious, but i'm not sure i'm following: is this backpressure you're refering too simply as the poppet closes during disconnection, and/or some residual pressure caused by momentum (movimg fluid + check balve +...

I believe this motor valve would be on my power-beyond path**, so the "return to tank" must be presurized (?). is this what you're referring to? ** although maybe i could make the return path tank/low-pressure with a different rear remote valve?

This is just for the feed roller, not the flywheel, which is pto driven. so shouldnt be any inertia / suddent stop concerns that an OP valve cant handle? The directional motor valve would have this OP valve built in i would think - and seems so from your link?

very interesting subject, these hydraulics are :) Running some napkin calcs, I measure that despite the problem (mismatched blind/rod cylinder hydraulic flow), a simple cushion valve would offer some minor buffer against shocks ... but probably not much. assume the fluid compresses 0.5% per...

seems obviously OK - but since I don't see any of the usual mfg's offering a discounted option omitting the pump, thought it was worth asking... I'd assume the valve for the motor is open-center, but if not, not terribly expensive to replace it. Maybe I'd need a restrictor since I'd be...

I have a 6" pto wood chipper coming shortly. As most/all small units do, it has a dedicated PTO driven hydraulic unit. Various threads indicate this is roughly a 3gpm pump. My tractor hydraulics are 6-7gpm, and I'm obviously not doing _anything_ else with the tractor while the chipper is...

if no one has experience with how compatible these are; is there a "standard" type stateside for tractors & implements?

still struggling to get a clear answer here, but one EverythingAttachements rep said: he believes that the connector they shipped (that's the grapple in the pic(s)) is the AG style, which would be ISO-5675 he thought that the one half inch size (specifically/solely) in ISO-5675 and ISO-7241-1 A...

yes, yes. I'm aware how to use calipers - what I couldn't do is take a picture from two angles. And the thread is picture-long enough as it is.

Here's info from the link in my OP about 5675 & 7241 not working robustly together, and summit-hydraulics, showing the parts. Notably, Summit does NOT show a ball for the iso5675? Is this correct?

Trying to identify the fittings on my tractor vs what came with an implement. I have two that seem extremely similar except the fluid-lock (ball, "poppet"). Some sites such as Incompatible Hydraulic Couplers: ISO 5675 (Ball, AG type) vs. ISO 7241-1 report some issues in cross-compatibility...

I have a greenworks pro 80v. I also have a sthil ms360 (60cc midsize saw), and a dewalt 20v short bar (a toy, but great for awkward delimbing etc) last year I used the greenworks for clearing a third of acre of pine, 3"-16", rather dense (>100 trees). It was spectacular for my use case...

I had a realization that concerns me about this app: The cushion/double relief valve simply "short circuits" both sides of the cylinder, allowing an overload condition to resolve by the rod moving with the load. they are marketed for exactly this purpose afaict. HOWEVER: isnt the area of the...

Yes, the grapple would open(close) with the overpressure (assuming this concept even works, see my comment about area of top/bottom of cylinder). my assumption was this cushion valve would have a "high" breaking pressure, higher than the FEL OPfor instance But you raise a good point that the...

Doesnt this valve connect both sides of the circuit to each other? so fluid moves either direction? However, thinking more about this, i realized that these cylinders have different areas on each end (due to the rod) - and thus different volume-per-inch-moved. meaning this wouldnt work in...

Correct - i made a joke that the entire tractor tips over, as your 'relief' if overloaded

see the "cushion valve" i linked above - I can't find a flow diagram, but my understanding is it works both ways. With no pressure on either control port (you're not using the lever; pressure drifts down to ~none), a high pressure on EITHER cylinder port will cross-over/short-circut, allowing...

for this thread, here is the relevant product type you want to solve this overpressure issue. Not normally included on budget grapples, but apparently common on some rentals, and larger/higher-end models "double relief valve" == "cushion valve" 1/2 NPT 30 GPM 1500-3000 PSI Hydraulic Cushion...

I've always had a tough time finding knee pads that STAY. I've had great success with these for the last ~5 years. (same 2 pairs, too) https://www.amazon.com/Sellstrom-S96110-Knee-Ultra-Flex/dp/B005I4PT18/ref=sr_1_13?crid=37OY02BB0S05F It's the joint, i think - means there is less push on the...

Wrong person quoted :)

Fair enough. i did just get my ea grapple, which was ordered in september.

Typically the US made, superior quality part is at LEAST 50% more, if not outright 2x. In this case, the EA 72" box blade is a few hundred dollars more ($200 more list, but there is shipping if you're not within 1000miles of them). IMHO here is one case it would be VERY hard to justify the...

Sounds ~accurate, thanks! (although it adds up to 11.2gpm; where'd my 1/2 gpm go kioti??) A bit disappointing on the flow for the hydraulics, but such it is (I knew it was lower, had thought it was a higher % of the total flow; but by the lenght of the sections, a 60/40% split does look...

great video, thanks. I'm actually surprised it ONLY got up to 5-6000psi. I would have expected more given the leverage. I didn't see any smaller relieve valves, but will keep looking. Any reason to think the large valve would be less effective here, or just 'overkill'? Since I'm installing...

have a ck2610. Happy with it (except for BH departure angle ... another topic). I'm making some hydraulic mods/additions and am not finding much specific information on the pump. Tractor is rated at 11.7 GPM. That is shared between the hydraulics, steering cylinders, and HST. Pump picture...

Thanks! these make sense conceptually. Amazing how much variety of hydraulic (or air) control systems there are. Almost like whole factories were run before computers... :) For #2, relief of grapple over pressure. My ck2610 spec says FEL OP valve is 2500psi (I plan to Tee in a gauge, haven't...

I created a dedicated thread for how to solve the "check valve" / accumulator / overpressure issue https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/threads/check-valves-accumulators-overpressure-oh-my.450020/

I have two problems where I've seen advice on TBN to solve with a "check valve": a cylinder "sags" - eg, my snowblower chute deflector. Set it at the angle i need; a minute later the deflector has drooped down. a grapple can experience very high pressures when, say, it's closed on a long tree...

Thanks for this - it's a great point. The grapple hydraulic circuit probably has it much worse, but the same leverage also works on the FEL. Thankfully (or NOT) the FEL has a "relief valve" of sorts, even with the valves closed .... tractor falls over if leverage(on FEL) is too high :)...

<dup>

Thanks for the name. Yes, that function sounds like it applies to the concern here - although in a ~month of reading about this I don't believe I've seen anyone else refer to it ... at a minimum it's highly uncommon on everyday TLB/grapple/etc (?) @davedj1, @2manyrocks, @LouNY discuss "check...

While the fact that the grapple runs the risk of unexpectedly high pressures makes sense as in the discussion above, and I can see how a check valve would at least isolate more of the system, I have two questions: the pressure still [could] rise unacceptably in the grapple cyclinders &...

I'm here learning about hydraulics, TBC ... but I think this one makes sense: with the other functions (FEL, etc), the load is "on" the action you're performing. As you lift, you are pushing against the load. Too high, and the OP valve will trigger, and the movement that's increasing the load...

He certainly should have NOT gone to the mfg first, and should have pressed the dealer responsible hard, all the way up to the ownership as you say. Including making clear that he will seek resolution even if it means the courts. However, i don't see it as unreasonable to go to the manufacture...

This might be a more reputable / powerful product; sold by Grainger and McMaster In addition to colors, they make the dye in fluorescent - meaning it's easy to see even dirty fluid on black engine parts Kingscote Bright Dyes® Solvent 250 Red Fluorescent Liquid Product Number: 506250-RF...

Kingscote also makes the dye listed above in fluorescent - meaning it's easy to see even dirty fluid on black engine parts Bright Dyes® Solvent 250 Red Fluorescent Liquid Product Number: 506250-RF McMaster-Carr...

actually, event better. Using McMaster (I trust it more than amazon, and unlike Granger it has application info Kingscote Bright Dyes comes in flourescent meaning it glows in UV - you can make it out even with dirty fluid on black engine parts. Bright Dyes® Solvent 250 Red Fluorescent Liquid...

Thanks. For reference here's the product link, kingscote Bright Dyes 506250-R4 4oz https://www.grainger.com/product/45H150 I was not able to find a mfg product page for that listing uses. However, i did find this mcmaster product (cheaper per oz, but only sold in 16oz) McMaster-Carr This...

Thats a great idea - is there an easy to obtain dye that is known completely benign for the system?

Now that I ~Mostly understand the flow, i was able to verify that both Loader and RR/Backhoe valves fully shunt/divert flow to Tank when active 3pt hitch is inoperable when either rear-remote valve, or Loader valve, are opened significantly rear remotes are inoperable when any Loader valve is...

I had some technical questions above and beyond installing my WRLong 3rd function. Brandon was beyond helpful. Highly recommend https://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/threads/power-beyond-flow-to-3rd-function-valve-before-vs-after-the-rear-remotes-valve.449943/post-6257772

WR Long also clarified that the hex fitting (looks like an "adapter" of sorts) is not an adapter but a "Power Beyond Sleeve" - I had not heard of this. Inside the valve, the "power beyond" fluid path often joins with the "tank"/"low pressure" fluid path (in the case of my RR valve, this would...

spoke to Brandon at WRLong - extremely helpful & seemed equally knowledgeable (as noted in other TBN threads) W.R. Long viewed installing the 3rd function between RearRemote-->3PTvalve (incorrectly labeled T in my pictures) is 100% viable. He agreed there is a minor pressure drop on any valve...

that makes sense as I look at it (picture below - 'axle' of the 3PT lever is below the blue cap, and the pink cap is on the speed control knob). i assume the tower w/ lock nuts ~2 inches down and right of the 'T' label in this picture is an OPvalve spring? regarding what is "T" port, vs "Power...

isn't there also a port associated with the OP valve? I believe the black-rubber/wrench flats you reference is JUST the sprint unit, correct? Assuming I have the correct, in my case is that the "To Trans[mission case]" in my Loader valve (1st) picture? And if I did not have any rear-remotes...

FWIW, both of these lines dump into the tank, it appears. I'm pointing at the bolt end of the pink/"T" labeled line. Also, while the tank _might_ be ~near atmospheric pressure it's still on the pressure path ... I can't really imagine that fuel line being used here; even the return would...

dealer says they've contacted Kioti, but the frame i have looks like the others they've installed. Assuming Kioti comes back as expected and says "good to go!" ... not sure what my options are, even though kioti advertises 21 degrees. I don't mind giving up 4 inches of dig depth (cutting off...

By 'removing' the rest of the valves from the PB loop, this would seem to (slightly) increase the power available to the loader; is this the reason / sole-reason for this? The loader valve does need an overpressure switch. I imagine the OPswitch could share a drain to tank with an intentional...

I'm installing a power beyond. I'm asking this question from a generic point of view, as I want to understand the hydraulic system as much as I just want to get it done (I find that sort of understanding will pay dividends later). That said, my unit is a ck2610, with factory loader and dual...

Thanks. Yeah, it sounds quite high. With all going on, i forgot to check it since I had CommercialTire fill all four tires with beet juice. Guess they juiced the pressure up to tractor-trailer levels ... Thankfully it hasn't got hot yet, I'll get it lowered to 40.

That's interesting - I know that kioti makes some bobcat; not sure if that is "all" of the CK's (yes?), and if they are 1-to-1's (eg, is the bobcat you show exactly a ck2610, ck3510, etc). do you have a model for the hoe shown? Would be curious to see how it mounts / specs / cost. Perhaps if...

Thanks, and greatly appreciate the measurements. It's odd that you and avmcane have different distances axle->kingpin. Kioti keeps making it longer. BTW, I read ~100psi on my rears (might be a tad high; i was trying to prevent beet juice from running into my gauge). I've emailed the...

Amvcane (sans the @mention...) confirmed (before deleting his post & pic above) that his 2012 CK3510se-hst, with kb2475 (no 'L') also has ~10" ground clearance to the kingpin, and that his kingpin is ~46" aft of the rear axles. it is interesting that both deezler and amvcane have a ck3510, but...

@Amvcane could you confirm you're pic is of your CK3510se-hst? If so, what's the size of your kb2475's "cockpit"? Searching for the response my dealer is going to give on why my subframe shouldn't look like yours (like some other design change between 2012->2021 that now 'requires' the BH to...

Good catch, thank you @Midniteoyl - unless @Amvcane clarifies he really meant DK, you're correct it's the exact same frame, tires, etc as mine. Clearly a different subframe. Being new, I was able to find the sticker hidden behind the wheel. Hopefully the serial `201101xxx` refers to...

EDIT1: waiting for clarification from @Amvcane but as his sig states & @Midniteoyl points out, DK -> CK3510 is the likely model. This is identical (including in tires) to my CK2610, just with a bigger engine. Specs on Kioti's site show same length, wheelbase, and most everything except...

first, for composting you need a good ratio of "nitrogen rich" to "carbon rich". Wood chips are the latter. Food waste and green foliage are the former. If you mix in grass clippings you'll get better results. Second, as others have mentioned, heat is your friend on speed. So if you can...

I use 3m EEP-100 "electronic earplugs". Lets me hear conversations, and has earplug-level noise protection. I use https://www.amazon.com/EEP-100-Rechargeable-Construction-Manufacturing-Maintenance/dp/B07P8YDBZD . They make a version with bluetooth audio (for your music) as well - and I see on...

would you mind sharing your departure angle? If, on level ground, you just measure the height/clearance at the bottom of the kingpin bracket, then the angle is a little less than arctan(kingpin" / 54") (a little less, because the contact patch on the tire is a little aft of the actual axle...

Around 10 degrees

Yeah, the design actually looks pretty straightforward to do a mod like this ... begs the question why it wasn't done like this with a different subframe. I don't even think you'd need to remove the links if you just added a few inches. But no way to do this in warranty, for sure.

this is _fully_ impossible, unfortunately (first thing i tried). The frame of the backhoe / stabilizer arms is nearly as wide as the track, and only slightly front & up from the kingpin - eg maybe a foot off the ground, and 4' aft of the axles. It physically impacts the rams well before the...

The root cause, I think I agree, is this: and suspiciously absent from the KB2475l manual itself is the smallest model ck2610:

yeah, i looked at both; I may have been pushed to the Kubota had I realized this exit angle, but in all the other respects the kioti system is fine / has it's advantages: faster to install/remove (no doubt it could be done faster than the 20 min this guy took , but it's still multiple bolts &...

Poor choice of words - mine looks like it is substantially lower than the pic, even on pavement.

99.99% sure the top link there just looks like its attached. there is zero structure up there, just the seat tube. ~confirmed with attach/removal videos; all attachment points are on the subframe. Yes, my pick in my yard makes it look a bit worse given the grass - but mine does look...

Yeah - mine looks NOTHING like that ... do you have a direct link to that video? I couldn't find one. Maybe i should reach out to the dealer.

also "angle of departure" along with "breakover", the thing that would prevent you from, say, loading onto the trailer.

I'm very happy with the tractor, and I think for the money it IS slightly better than the kubota L2501 i compared it to ... but with this issue i do have slight buyers remorse.

had my kb2475l installed recently for the ck2610 i bought last year (backhoe took for ever to ship). I didn't make much of an issue with the geometry of the hoe as it's mounted on the tractor; driving my dad's small kubota CUT as a kid, he never took the backhoe off, and had no problem using...