Snow Attachments ABS Plastic Pipe Snow Blade Edge

[Inkomodius]

I worked in a plumbing supply store, and they generally call PVC pipe "sch 40" even though the scheduale wall thickness system applies to any pipe using the nominal pipe measuring system EG: ERW black steel pipe uses the nominal pipe system as well.

ABS is the black DWV piping (drain waste vent) used for sewer. PVC is white used for potable water supply.

I havent seen HDPE piping but that would be the cats meow. We put sheets of that on the bottom of river boats here to bank off of rocks and its tough stuff!

 

[bp fick]

I've tried 1 1/2", 2" and 3"

A pattern has formed. Obviously, the bigger the diameter, the greater the "float" effect. It's a no brainer. The float factor is your friend, if you are gouging grass, digging up gravel, etc. YMMV.

That said, you can over do it. Once the ground begins to freeze up, you may wish to lower the diameter for a smaller "edge" and more cutting, less float.
You may also wish to remove it altogether, at that point.

 

[TedReese]

If you want HDPE go look in the irrigation section of Home Depot, Lowes, etc. They sell it in rolls, usually 100' lengths. They usually have various thicknesses of material rated by the service pressure they are intended to carry. Coming in a roll it may be hard to split and place on a blade.

 

[Steve C]

If you want HDPE go look in the irrigation section of Home Depot, Lowes, etc. They sell it in rolls, usually 100' lengths. They usually have various thicknesses of material rated by the service pressure they are intended to carry. Coming in a roll it may be hard to split and place on a blade.

Yes you are correct, the stuff that I have is 30 years old, and it is still wants to stay coiled up in a 6 foot diameter roll. A 4 1/2" grinder with a abrasive cut off blade works good for splitting it as does a 5 1/2" circular saw. Once you pound it on the blade edge though it will stay straight

 

[Steve C]

Schedule XX is a measurement of thickness/gauge basically. Ask a pro, which I am not.

These different plastics vary widely in their abilities and characteristics, strengths, resiliency, impact, shatter temperatures, etc. None of these products were designed for what we are doing with them.

That said, PVC is pretty brittle, ABS much, much less so, and HDPE is space-age stuff, but I cannot get my hands on any out here in the sticks!

I suppose Kevlar, if made into such a pipe would be as strong or stronger than steel itself.

HDPE ( High density polyethelene ) isn't space age stuff. It has been around a long time and it is cheap. It is very impact resistant. I don't think you could break it with a hammer if you tried. It is also soft as compared to PVC or ABS. You can leave a mark in it with your thumb nail. But you can hit it as hard as you can with a hammer and it will just bounce off! Since it is relatively soft it will probably wear at a faster rate than ABS.

 

[bp fick]

HDPE ( High density polyethelene ) isn't space age stuff.

Steve,

OK, it was first made into pipe in 1955, while Sputnik launched the space age in 1957, so HDPE technically pre-dates the space age by two years. Mea Culpa!

I'm quite happy, so far, with my ABS.

How much snow did you guys get down that way?

 

[Steve C]

Steve,

OK, it was first made into pipe in 1955, while Sputnik launched the space age in 1957, so HDPE technically pre-dates the space age by two years. Mea Culpa!

I'm quite happy, so far, with my ABS.

How much snow did you guys get down that way?

It is hard to tell it keeps blowing around in piles, I would think it is only about 6 inches if you can find a level spot! But it is blown in hard enough to walk on the 2 foot drifts without sinking in....

 

[bp fick]

Lowe's and the other box stores around here carry ABS. Not nearly the selection as PVC though. I looked at some the other day and noticed the price for ABS was about 30 - 50% higher than PVC. That could be due to old stock that reflects the higher oil prices from last year. I have a partial paved drive, but mostly gravel. I'm curious if it would clear a concrete drive or make a mess.

ABS isn't all that pricey. A 10' stick of 1 1/2" is $3.93 at Lowes.
Check this:
Silver-Line Plastics at Lowe's: 1-1/2" x 10' ABS Cellular Core Pipe

What I cannot tell is whether this piece is comparable to what I got at ACE today.

 

[mjncad]

What is the difference between HDPE and schedule 80? I've called three plumbing supply houses and they seem clueless when I say "High Density Polyethyline" but admit that they have schedule 80. What is the difference?

As you have noted, HDPE is the type of material. As another has noted, Schedule 80 refers to the pipe's wall thickness regardless of material. The most common schedules in use are 40, then 80, then 160. There are Schedules 5, 10, 20; but they are rarely used regardless of material type and hence tend to cost more because they aren't readily available. In steel pipe there are XS (eXtra Strong) and XXS (double eXtra Strong, eXtra eXtra Strong) too. The Schedule 160 is referring to steel. Who, why and when created the schedule numbers is unknown to me. That's a sad commentary on the plumbing supply houses' staff if they don't know the difference between HDPE and Schedule 80.

Interesting test results on the ABS pipe, I may develop a whole new respect for the stuff. I think it's the Butadiene in the plastic that gives it its ductility. When I was a model maker as a teen, I used butadiene tubing sold by Plastruct. That stuff was a nuisance to use because it was so soft compared to Acrylic and Styrene.

 

[NSBound]

Interesting test results on the ABS pipe, I may develop a whole new respect for the stuff. I think it's the Butadiene in the plastic that gives it its ductility. When I was a model maker as a teen, I used butadiene tubing sold by Plastruct. That stuff was a nuisance to use because it was so soft compared to Acrylic and Styrene.

You must be related to patrickg!!

 

[JB4310]

I am not surprised at the abs vs pvc cold weather brittleness testing.
But generally I consider pvc superior to abs in the construction field, just not in this application as proven by the tests shown here.

After seeing all these blades with pipe installed, at first I thought it was kinda silly but out of desperation I tried it myself. I used 1.5" with a single blade kerf, slid it on length wise from one end. Put it on my 60" rear blade to help with our first wet snowfall on unfrozen gravel yard areas.

Wasn't blown away by it as my first attempt with weighted blade dropped in full float caused considerable digging in not as bad as with no pipe, and this ground was uncharacteristically soft.
I could lower it a little lighter where it would still scrape but not dig in, I only made a few passes so the jury's still out on my opinion.
Ended up having to go over everything with 6ft rake cause it was so messed up, mixed all the stone and slush evenly, good thing cause now it's frozen solid.

 

[foggy1111]

OK....been reading on this thread....and see some clarification is needed in a few areas.

HDPE is High Density Poly Ethylene

LDPE is Low Density Poly Ethylene

UMHW PE is ultra high molecular weight poly ethylene which is a higher-yet densisty than HDPE

When chosen correctly, these are some pretty high performance plastics with a relatively low cost.

Schedule xx pipe refers to the wall thickness of steel pipe and was long ago established for strength criteria for the plumbing industry (I think). All of the various schedules (sch 5, 10, 40, 80) of the same size pipe are the same outside diameter (OD) just the inside diameter and wall thickness changes with a different schedule number. Plastic pipe is made to the same dimential specs as the steel standard - from many years ago (I beleive).

All plastics are not created equally. The physical and chemical properties of some of today's plastics is phenomenal. Now....if engineers would only pick the right ones.....and not be so tight.

 

[dcyrilc]

I am not surprised at the abs vs pvc cold weather brittleness testing.
But generally I consider pvc superior to abs in the construction field, just not in this application as proven by the tests shown here.

After seeing all these blades with pipe installed, at first I thought it was kinda silly but out of desperation I tried it myself. I used 1.5" with a single blade kerf, slid it on length wise from one end. Put it on my 60" rear blade to help with our first wet snowfall on unfrozen gravel yard areas.

Wasn't blown away by it as my first attempt with weighted blade dropped in full float caused considerable digging in not as bad as with no pipe, and this ground was uncharacteristically soft.
I could lower it a little lighter where it would still scrape but not dig in, I only made a few passes so the jury's still out on my opinion.
Ended up having to go over everything with 6ft rake cause it was so messed up, mixed all the stone and slush evenly, good thing cause now it's frozen solid.

Try the 3" next time the ground is soft. You should find that it doesn't dig in as bad. The larger diameter will tend to slide ove the ground better without digging in.

 

[mjncad]

Now....if engineers would only pick the right ones.....and not be so tight.

Blame the bean counters, not the engineers. My bean counter wife and I have had numerous discussions on this issue.

 

[mjncad]

You must be related to patrickg!!

LOL...Nope; but I'm curious as to why I gave you that impression. I do read Patrick's posts.

 

[studor]

JB4310 -- the weight is probably part of the issue. When iI use my back blade for snow I have just the blade and the pipe --seems heavy enough on its own to drag the snow without digging in -- JMHO

 

[JB4310]

JB4310 -- the weight is probably part of the issue. When iI use my back blade for snow I have just the blade and the pipe --seems heavy enough on its own to darg the snow without digging in -- JMHO

Yeah I have the weight on there to help with pulling the blade reversed, also just for that same reason of not digging into soft ground. I even had 4 of those heavy weights on there, but it still didn't clean that great

 

[adirondacktrac]

A PVC Backblade Installation Report: A quick update on the durability of my 1-1/2" PVC experience. We had about 15" of new snow on unfrozen gravel and grassy parking areas. At about 0 deg. F, I had good clearing performance with my 72" KK backplade and also the similarly shod FEL bucket; no torn surfaces and no splits, no dings and no breaks in the PVC pipe. That's not to say the problems experienced by a Michigan member won't hit me here in northern NY, but after 4 hours of plowing, so far, so good. Have some tough plastic well pipe in reserve when and if the PVC tanks.

 

[bp fick]

A PVC Backblade Installation Report: A quick update on the durability of my 1-1/2" PVC experience. We had about 15" of new snow on unfrozen gravel and grassy parking areas. At about 0 deg. F, I had good clearing performance with my 72" KK backplade and also the similarly shod FEL bucket; no torn surfaces and no splits, no dings and no breaks in the PVC pipe. That's not to say the problems experienced by a Michigan member won't hit me here in northern NY, but after 4 hours of plowing, so far, so good. Have some tough plastic well pipe in reserve when and if the PVC tanks.

Well, Clearly, there's only one logical explanation for this.
The rocks you all have over there in NY are much softer than the rocks we have over here in MI.
Gosh, I hope it isn't yet another Deere vs. Kubota thing. I hadn't considered that variable.

 

[Steve C]

Well, Clearly, there's only one logical explanation for this.
The rocks you all have over there in NY are much softer than the rocks we have over here in MI.
Gosh, I hope it isn't yet another Deere vs. Kubota thing. I hadn't considered that variable.

I think your theory about the rocks is correct. After all they are hard enough in Michigan to make grindstones out of. And we have Grindstone City to prove it!

The only thing harder than grindstones are frozen grindstones.