Tier 4

[grm61]

Yes, on a 50hp and under tractor, you will likely incur some cost and extra wiring due to Tier 4 emissions.

The OP, clearly, is new to tractors. not knowing the difference between a tier 3 and tier 4 cut, their is a little more to it than some extra cost and wiring.

This....

As I said, basically you get a cool stainless muffler and a little different user experience.

is typical sales babble, and is misleading to folks that don't know any better.

Over 50hp (and especially over 75hp), you'd hardly notice the difference if it wasent there.

Really?:laughing:

As Diller23 said, if you dont like it, dont buy it. Simple as that

I never said that I didn't like it...I said...

I do sincerely hope that the new machines are trouble free, but I was not willing to take the chance.

And no I didn't buy it.

 

[ShowroomShine]

I never said that I didn't like it...I said... And no I didn't buy it.

Ahh I see now, must have misunderstood you. Clearly I was too busy babbling to pay attention.

Go study up on some Tier 4 technology, its apparent you could use some clarification.

 

[grm61]

Ahh I see now, must have misunderstood you. Clearly I was too busy babbling to pay attention.

Go study up on some Tier 4 technology, its apparent you could use some clarification.

Have a nice day

 

[DarkBlack]

Like I said before some people are clearly trying to put lipstick on a pig.

 

[the old grind]

Like I said before some people are clearly trying to put lipstick on a pig.

.... and probably ride bicycles vs drive or operate anything. Imagine trying to put a 3ph or FEL on your Schwinn. :irked:

Anxiously awaiting the new hybrid-electric row crop line with solar cell cab/canopy options ...

 

[GManBart]

'Green' concepts will bear out over time but our contribution either way can't or won't be quantified to the nth degree in a mere lifetime. IMO pollution warrants our attention on par with temp rise, as we might suffocate ourselves long before we cook ourselves. If governments aren't doing the right things, at least they're getting our attention. :2cents:

Peak smog levels in LA are down 70% since 1980. Coincidence? There sure seems to be a relationship to rising emission standards there that are well within a lifetime.

 

[DarkBlack]

I think you're trying to change the original post's intent of question. Debating EPA regulation's effectiveness is a whole different subject.
This thread is about Tier3 vs Tier4 and for most people it's about paying more for a more complex machine that is used infrequently.

 

[Piston]

This thread :thumbsdown:

 

[GManBart]

I think you're trying to change the original post's intent of question. Debating EPA regulation's effectiveness is a whole different subject.
This thread is about Tier3 vs Tier4 and for most people it's about paying more for a more complex machine that is used infrequently.

I'm not the one who started in on the whole government/EPA theme.

Who said the machines are used infrequently? Some folks run them daily, or at least weekly. I'm just a weekend warrior, and I put over 200 hours on my LS in 16 months, and put many additional hours on my 8N, and Massey during the same timeframe.

I've also pointed out how the prices aren't necessarily any higher. The Kioti NX series costs a bit more than the DK it replaces, but added a host of features that at least cover the price increase. Is it a bit more complex? Sure. Is it such a huge change that they're suddenly going to start failing regularly...we'll see, but I doubt it since its pretty mature technology at this point.

Will other brands follow similar pricing changes? We'll have to see, but I suspect some of the legacy brands won't skip an opportunity to jack up their prices.

 

[GManBart]

This thread :thumbsdown:

Nobody forced you to read it.

 

[DarkBlack]

Peak smog levels in LA are down 70% since 1980. Coincidence? There sure seems to be a relationship to rising emission standards there that are well within a lifetime.

If that post isn't a pro-regulation plug, for big government laws = clean air, then I don't know what would be.

If I was looking to buy a new tractor, I'd look Tier 3 first, all the way.

 

[Jim Nelson]

Peak smog levels in LA are down 70% since 1980. Coincidence? There sure seems to be a relationship to rising emission standards there that are well within a lifetime.

In 1957 my mother and I traveled from our home in Colo. to L.A. to visit her sisters and I couldn't understand why I could stand outside in the afternoon and look directly at the sun and it was just a big orange ball in the sky,you couldn't hardly breath and your eyes watered constantly. Along came the EPA and regulations that everyone complained about but now the air is cleaner in southern Ca. than in Denver. The problem is that like any bureaucracy it didn't stop when the problem was fixed but kept feeding on itself and growing bigger everyday. At some point a logical person has to think that we have to pay a price for our life style and call it good enough.It has come to the point that it seems the only reason for all the new regulations is to pull more money from the economy.
Back in 1957 a family could live well on one income but not any more and the biggest reason for this is government over reach.If you want Tier 4,5,6 or whatever comes next be ready to pay for it because it just gets more expensive and the money has to come out of your budget not some magic "government funding".

 

[F3506]

If you think all of this clean air stuff is nonsense, look at what is happening in China. They ran rampant for years, and now it's so bad they're starting to implement measures to reduce the rights of people to own regular cars. Yes, their main problem is coal power plants, but it all adds up.

Instead, why don't we compare a tier 1 or 2 tractor that's just a handful of years old to a tractor made in the 60's. Technology has come a long way and so has the resulting emissions, without having to pee in the tank.

In 1957 my mother and I traveled from our home in Colo. to L.A. to visit her sisters and I couldn't understand why I could stand outside in the afternoon and look directly at the sun and it was just a big orange ball in the sky,you couldn't hardly breath and your eyes watered constantly. Along came the EPA and regulations that everyone complained about but now the air is cleaner in southern Ca. than in Denver. The problem is that like any bureaucracy it didn't stop when the problem was fixed but kept feeding on itself and growing bigger everyday. At some point a logical person has to think that we have to pay a price for our life style and call it good enough.It has come to the point that it seems the only reason for all the new regulations is to pull more money from the economy.
Back in 1957 a family could live well on one income but not any more and the biggest reason for this is government over reach.If you want Tier 4,5,6 or whatever comes next be ready to pay for it because it just gets more expensive and the money has to come out of your budget not some magic "government funding".

Well said. Many emissions in the US have reached the point where further cuts shouldn't be the priority if the global climate is really what we're worried about. Look at the emissions of those super tankers on the ocean.

 

[GManBart]

If that post isn't a pro-regulation plug, for big government laws = clean air, then I don't know what would be.

If I was looking to buy a new tractor, I'd look Tier 3 first, all the way.

It's simply a statement of fact.

I'm still not the one that introduced the topic of government/EPA to the discussion.

As as been said before, if you don't like it, don't buy it. If you never want another we tractor, it won't be an issue. :thumbsup:

 

[GManBart]

The problem is that like any bureaucracy it didn't stop when the problem was fixed but kept feeding on itself and growing bigger everyday. At some point a logical person has to think that we have to pay a price for our life style and call it good.

The EPA has actually been declining in size for a dozen years, and is at it's lowest point in about 20 years.

I agree there has to be a logical stopping point, and we may be at it. The current Tiers were agreed upon 20 years ago, and they haven't been expanded....haven't seen any expansion of them mentioned anywhere, and it may be because Tier IV standards equal a very clean engine as far as emisions go. Hopefully that's the case, but there isn't any discussion of Tier V from what I've read.

 

[the old grind]

......
Back in 1957 a family could live well on one income but not any more and the biggest reason for this is government over reach.If you want Tier 4,5,6 or whatever comes next be ready to pay for it because it just gets more expensive and the money has to come out of your budget not some magic "government funding".

IIRC back in '57 a family typically had 1 car & one TV. Five of us in mine then and Dad had a pretty good job at the TV station. In second grade then, I bought my own bike, my first full sized, and emptied my own piggy bank to do so. Dad bought a new station wagon to replace the '53 Olds. We weren't 'well to do', but looking back we were 'doing well', and looked up to if nothing else because Dad had a white collar job.

Now? Seems everyone with driv lic has their own wheels, a phone in their pocket, a TV in their own room and o'all the 'family' pays for I-net, cable, OnStar a summer place with amenities to hunt/fish there, and even hobby tractors, OR ... they consider themselves underprivileged. My point? Things have changed and will change.

If this thread is now junk we might as well just choose up sides and go away mad, or blame all changes on the gov't and could boycott new vehicles of any type. Who suffers most? Wasn't this about taking our turn in the barrel a few pages back? Americans & tractor owners are under the gun, like it or not, and a bunch of us don't.

btw, Bart, you're not the only one who's helped themselves get backed into a corner lately and felt some heat by defending a viewpoint unnecessarily. (BTDT) If I'm seen as taking your side its grudgingly to be sure. Good points on both sides as always, but let us air our gripes and live with the inevitable. IMO what we could use right now is a better representation of folks who are living with the Tiers, or should I say 'surviving' if it's that big a challenge. Sucks to be one, but we'll manage ...

Sincerely,
just another guy with my own opinions.

 

[grm61]

The air is definitely cleaner today no doubt, mostly due to more stringent emission controls.
The thread has gotten off track, the OP has a choice between tier 3 and 4, folks won't have that soon unless they buy used.

As long as things are off track..if you like old cars, here is a vid driving around LA in the 40s check out the smog:shocked:A Drive Through Bunker Hill and Downtown Los Angeles, ca. 1940s - YouTube

 

[the old grind]

Bullet-nosed 'Studes' (actually '50 & '51 models, .. thank you Raymond Loewy & Bob Bourke ), a few other obviously post-war cars & Ford trucks, and what looks like a ~'49-ish Buick in the curb lane around 4:11 or so. Crisp shadows suggest another sunny day in So Cal. Folks afoot don't look to be sweltering, so I might not buy mid-day fog or 'muggy'. Really opens the eyes to the mess around 5:11 where we see what looks like a low hanging cloud. That ain't just haze.

Thanks for posting! So much 'eye candy' .. with wheels. (ok the ladies, too) I'm sure anyone still here is just looking for entertainment anyway ... & I for one like 'lemonade'.

 

[F3506]

.... Hopefully that's the case, but there isn't any discussion of Tier V from what I've read.

Look at the construction industry. They're a bit better organized in off road diesel news. Scuttlebutt there is CO2 emissions since the court rulings have been indicating the EPA will have free reign to start regulating that.

 

[F3506]

Lousy internet connection = double post.