3500 truck needs CDL?

[Turbys_1700]

So according to the flow chart I don't need a class A or CDL to pull a trailer over 10K...
Why would the state issue a license that states a 10K limit on it?
I understand what you are saying LD1...
Not trying to get into a peeing contest...
I certainly respect your opinion...
I'm just trying to wrap my head around the idea that I can pull a trailer over 10K and not get a ticket as long as I am under 26K...

 

[LD1]

As long it's not for commercial purposes.

That info on the back of your license is on the back of a class c cdl. So it is assumed you are driving a vehicle meeting that description, in that it's designed to haul 16+ people. If that's the vehicle you are driving.....and doing so commercially.....the info is 100% correct.

If you are NOT driving a class c vehicle.....info doesn't apply.

 

[tcartwri]

We need to back up here a little bit. The first threshold in the flow chart is in Gross Combined Rating. You need to read the fine print below that chart to understand how enforcement will interpret that number...

I believe that every dually made now is rated for over 26K "Combined". The fine print under the chart says that this manufacturers rating would be applied "if" it was printed on the door sticker. I don't believe I've ever seen this number printed in a door sticker though.

But obviously DOT knows what the minimum combined rating is for these trucks. So I wouldn't be surprised if they require a class A ( either commercial or non commercial ) to pull any gooseneck.

You absolutely need a non commercial class A in Ontario for example. Except for an RV....perversely.

 

[Turbys_1700]

As long it's not for commercial purposes.

That info on the back of your license is on the back of a class c cdl. So it is assumed you are driving a vehicle meeting that description, in that it's designed to haul 16+ people. If that's the vehicle you are driving.....and doing so commercially.....the info is 100% correct.

If you are NOT driving a class c vehicle.....info doesn't apply.

Thank you for the clarification LD1...
I really appreciate it...

I've got to get my air brake endorsement for a truck my dad has given me...
Guess I should have taken it when I did the CDL C for the 16+ certification for the church van...
Since it did not have air brakes I did not have a vehicle to do the on site test...
1975 GMC 6500 with 13' dump and air brakes...
Chevy registration tag on inside door is 24K...
427 truck engine...

 

[terryknight]

We need to back up here a little bit. The first threshold in the flow chart is in Gross Combined Rating. You need to read the fine print below that chart to understand how enforcement will interpret that number...

I believe that every dually made now is rated for over 26K "Combined". The fine print under the chart says that this manufacturers rating would be applied "if" it was printed on the door sticker. I don't believe I've ever seen this number printed in a door sticker though.

But obviously DOT knows what the minimum combined rating is for these trucks. So I wouldn't be surprised if they require a class A ( either commercial or non commercial ) to pull any gooseneck.

You absolutely need a non commercial class A in Ontario for example. Except for an RV....perversely.

When DOT talks about "combined" they are talking about adding the GVWR for the tow vehicle and teh GVWR of the tailer. not the "GCVWR" the tow vehicle is rated for from the manufacturer

and yes i think the bog three all rate the GCVWR for there "one tons" at more than 26K

 

[LD1]

When DOT talks about "combined" they are talking about adding the GVWR for the tow vehicle and teh GVWR of the tailer. not the "GCVWR" the tow vehicle is rated for from the manufacturer

and yes i think the bog three all rate the GCVWR for there "one tons" at more than 26K

Correct. Whatever the mfg rates them for is irrelevant, at least here in the states.

3/4 ton with a 9990 gvwr can tow a trailer to 16k commercially without a class A

A 1+ton with a 12.2k gvwr cannot even tow a 14k trailer commercially without a CDL A. Same license required to drive a 80k, 53' semi. Stupid if you ask me, but that's the law

 

[em14]

LD1 - I must drive through 3 States to get to my farm. I have a 2007 Chevrolet HD 3500 (Weighs: 6000+) and I pull a 10T Goose Neck Trailer (Weighs 6,000+) and haul a JD 6420 (Weighs 12,000). The total weigh is approx 24000 lbs. I do not plan to bring this tractor back to Florida but I am hearing the DOT does not care if the weigh of the load is under the mfg rating of the trailer in GA and maybe the same in the other 2 States. They weigh the rated in their load Calculation. So my question - is the trailer rating going to be my problem child! I would appreciate your opinion! I forgot to tell you the distance between here and AL is 350 miles!
Thanks,
Leo

 

[LD1]

If you were towing commercially, the 20k. Rating would be an issue, because I am sure the gvwr on tor truck is probably well over 6k.

So the gvwr is well over 26k.

Remember, it ain't what the load weighs. It's the combination is rated to weigh at its max.

 

[RedNeckRacin]

Just because it's personal use doesn't mean you can throw the ratings out the window either once you get over the 26k GCWR with an over 10k trailer you STILL need a class A.

Home

 

[Midniteoyl]

Just because it's personal use doesn't mean you can throw the ratings out the window either once you get over the 26k GCWR with an over 10k trailer you STILL need a class A.

Home

Not all states give out Noncommercial Class A's.. Types of Driver's Licenses - AAA Digest of Motor Laws

Remember, we were talking about CDL's here, which are commercial, not any other requirements a state may require, though it probably is a good idea to know what your state requires.

 

[HK45]

Im in Pa. I was told by dot that if our not making any money as long as your truck and trailer don't go over the 26001 your fine. They only look at 2 things trucks GVWR and trailer GVWR. In my case truck 11,500 trailer 14,000 put me at 25,500 under the 26001. One thing you will need if over 17,000p is a medical card. Know they told me if Im making one penny from moving my stuff around I would Need a CDL. Problem is even single axle truck like the ram 3500 crew long bed GVWR is 12,300, So with the trailer I have I would need to sell them and get new ones and derate them under the 14,000. Kinda of suck the big 3 are upping GVWR.

 

[HK45]

Back to the DL issue with what it says. DOT told me that its kinda of weird how they put that down on the DL but again anything over 10,000 for profit you will need a class A. If your private and not making any profit you do not need a CDL. They should state that on the DL. Thats why you see guys hauling heavy with the signs that say not for hire on there truck. Again this is for Pa. Boils down to they want there money if your making money

 

[newbury]

That doesn't make it safe or a good idea. Just because some snot-nosed kid got a full driver's license should not mean that he should be able to operate a 50k-pound rig on the road with no further training.

Or to me even worse some 80 lb housewife who can't see over the steering wheel or some old retired codger with the reaction time of molasses.

If your trailer is over 10K you must have Class A's or CDL's...
It states it on the license...
I live here...

Do you realize someone could probably scan in the pattern on your license and get a lot of data?

It means that most information spewed about CDLs on all forums, including trucking and coo forums is wrong. The info you give is 100% correct.

Can't somebody say something nice without you getting defensive?

I understand LD1's reaction - your phrasing was slightly unclear and had me wondering.

Not all states give out Noncommercial Class A's.. Types of Driver's Licenses - AAA Digest of Motor Laws

Remember, we were talking about CDL's here, which are commercial, not any other requirements a state may require, though it probably is a good idea to know what your state requires.

We must remember there are many things going on:
What's legal in YOUR STATE where your stuff is licensed
What's legal in other states you may be passing through
What your rig looks like
What you look like
How the LEO is feeling
How the laws are enforced where you are at any given time
How much hassle you want to put up with

I've a dually rated for 11.5K and a trailer rated for 12K and one of the main things I'm doing with them is towing "loads" of personal belongings down to my future retirement farm in Mississippi from Northern Virginia. Depending on my route I pass through Georgia, South Carolina, North Carolina, Tennessee, Alabama and Mississippi.
So in VA I'm pretty well legal with a full up load.

BUT I think in all of them I'm subject to being stopped and asked to prove I'm not hauling commercial because of the 10k trailer limit.

 

[LD1]

Back to the DL issue with what it says. DOT told me that its kinda of weird how they put that down on the DL but again anything over 10,000 for profit you will need a class A. If your private and not making any profit you do not need a CDL. They should state that on the DL. Thats why you see guys hauling heavy with the signs that say not for hire on there truck. Again this is for Pa. Boils down to they want there money if your making money

The + or - 10k trailer still only applies if either the combo puts you over 26k, or the tow vehicle hauls more than 16 ppl.

Everyone want to keep getting hung up on 10k.

Let's assume this IS for profit and not personal use.

If your combo of trailer and truck go OVER 26k, then you either need CDL A or CDL B.

The over or under 10k is only for determining which class.

Nowhere is over or under 10k used for determining the need for a CDL.

 

[Soundguy]

I wasn't getting defensive, and hoped that is what you ment.

Re-read it word for word. It could also mean that it's rare that "I" know what I am talking about.

So I wasn't sure which direction you were going with the statement, and wanted clarification for me and everyone else reading

Yeah, when I first read it I was thinking "ouch" .. Then figured out what I thought he meant.

 

[Rock knocker]

If your combo of trailer and truck go OVER 26k, then you either need CDL A or CDL B.

A combination of exactly 36K, composed of a power unit of exactly 26K and a trailer of exactly 10K only requires a standard drivers license

 

[bdog]

The + or - 10k trailer still only applies if either the combo puts you over 26k, or the tow vehicle hauls more than 16 ppl.

Everyone want to keep getting hung up on 10k.

Let's assume this IS for profit and not personal use.

If your combo of trailer and truck go OVER 26k, then you either need CDL A or CDL B.

The over or under 10k is only for determining which class.

Nowhere is over or under 10k used for determining the need for a CDL.

On a federal level yes but some states require a CDL or class A non commercial for any trailer over 10k even if under 26k. California is an example.

While I tend to agree you do not necessarily need a CDL to drive something over 26k you do either need to fall under some type of exemption such as farm, OR have a non commercial license of a class higher than a class C. For example in Texas they offer non commercial class A and B licenses. TxDPS - Classes of Driver Licenses

I am sure most states handle this in different ways and some states may not even offer a non commercial class A or B and force you to get a CDL if you go over 26k but I am pretty sure in most if not all states Joe blow with a class C license can't legally drive a 14k GVWR dually pulling a 14k trailer without h either a CDL or a non commercial class A or falling under a farm exemption of some sort.

 

[joefromga]

How do you get a CDL. CLASS A if you only have a dually 3500 (over 12.5k)and an empty 14k trailer?

Can you take the test with that setup?

If you don't have air brakes you obviously won't get that certification but I wonder if people have done this to get their class A?

I also wonder why they deemed it safer to tow a heavier trailer with a much lighter truck (3500 pulling 14k vs 25500 pulling only 10k)

There should be an "obviously empty" exemption to the weight rule. So you can transport heavy but empty trailers and vehicles that are obviously empty.

Because you could put a 14k trailer on top of a 7500k trailer and pull it with a 25500 truck and be legal but not pull that safer load of that same 14k trailer empty and without the 7500k trailer.

 

[LD1]

A combination of exactly 36K, composed of a power unit of exactly 26K and a trailer of exactly 10K only requires a standard drivers license

No.

The combo only needs to be over 26k. Not just the truck.

If the combo is over 26k, and the trailer is under 10k.....(IE a ford F550 w/19,500gvw and a 7k trailer)....Class B

If the combo is over 26k and the trailer is over 10k.....(IE: 1-ton w/13k gvw and 14k trailer)....class A.

If there is no trailer to tow, then you only worry if the truck alone is over 26k....and if it is ....Class B

 

[RedNeckRacin]

How do you get a CDL. CLASS A if you only have a dually 3500 (over 12.5k)and an empty 14k trailer?

Can you take the test with that setup?

If you don't have air brakes you obviously won't get that certification but I wonder if people have done this to get their class A?

I also wonder why they deemed it safer to tow a heavier trailer with a much lighter truck (3500 pulling 14k vs 25500 pulling only 10k)

There should be an "obviously empty" exemption to the weight rule. So you can transport heavy but empty trailers and vehicles that are obviously empty.

Because you could put a 14k trailer on top of a 7500k trailer and pull it with a 25500 truck and be legal but not pull that safer load of that same 14k trailer empty and without the 7500k trailer.

Yes you can take the test with that setup but there wi be restrictions on your license. I.e. No air brake endorsement. In pa, I heard rumors that due to all the hot shot dually gn setups that there was going to be a fifth wheel restriction as well as an automatic transmission restriction depending on what you took the driving test in.